first article of preamble of Ismaili Constitution

[shivaathervedi]

I would add, how many Muslim countries are helping Afghanistan?

And if you look at the video of the group photo taken at the Bruxelles Afghanistan Conference, in the Euronews video you can see Hazar Imam. In the Al-Jazirah news, Hazar Imam is not seen as if he had disappeared by miracle from the place...

Mostly Muslim countries are poor, in political turmoils, and are financially indebted to world bank and IMF, but still some Muslim countries are helping Afghanistan financially, like Pakistan who last year gave Afghanistan grant of 200 millions, same way Qatar, Saudis, Emirates and other financially sound countries are helping. THE MAIN PROBLEM OF AFGHANISTAN IS CORRUPTION THAT'S WHY THEY HESITATE TO PROVIDE HELP.
Mostly Muslim rulers respect Hazar Imam except few middle eastern puppet governments easy to be black mailed by foreign forces. But governments of USA, Canada, European countries do respect Hazar Imam that's why he was present in the forum of world leaders.

[shivaathervedi]

At time of inaugural function of Aga Khan University in Karachi, General Zia presented a Copy of Quran to Hazar Imam. Next day in some news papers a discussion started "How come General Zia gave Quran in hands of a non Muslim."

That is exactly the point I am making today. The Imam is not considered a leader by the majority to warrant him to take any initiative to improve the conditions directly, though indirectly he is doing so through AKDN.

How many Muslims would have known about the conference on Afghanistan? How many newspapers in the Muslim world would have reported about it?

AKDN is not a political institution, and it is not in it's mandate to solve political problems and stop killings. My question was in the back ground of if he is universal God then he is all powerful to solve worldly problems and stop killings of innocent peoples.
In 56 Muslim countries mostly Muslim public is uneducated may be more than 65%. They can't read news papers, they do not have luxury of TV or internet. Mostly news papers in Muslim countries have given space to Afghanistan forum beside other main outlets of news world.

[nuseri]

Ya Ali Madad:
regarding the post of interview of MHI by a senior journalist.
1. as a senior journalist of repute ,they used precise word and are excellent in Grammer and what they publish get vetted by seniors above them.
there are 4-5 word that are used for the satisfaction of mind.
the word WARM is a physical body feeling around the the cold sourroundings.
I will given a true example and need answer from Ms A/T and our Baby creature

In a Christian family in Europe. a family with 04 year old son then.
the father told the soon if he is good at prep nursery,Santa Claus will get lot of gifts for him.
When the son gets older ,he came know that there was a no Santa Claus but his father who got gifts for him and lied to him about Santa Claus
my question is
1.Should the son brand his father as a liar as he committed a Sin and assume his father as a Liar that for all his life.
OR.
2.Is the father right in telling him looking at understanding his mental ability
of his son then and as per christian traditions about Santa Claus gifting him.Father thinks he committed no sin in telling a lie to his son for his son's good.
WHO IS WRONG HERE Father or the Son? Answers needed to move forward to get into deeper analysis into that interview.
Question is very simple but the answer may be not.

[kmaherali]

Moses and Jesus are also Prophets of Islam and Quran was revealed bacause changes in Jewish and Christian scriptures. Hindu mythology or Hindu gods cannot be taught bacause it leds to idol worship.

Islam is much more broader than that, there was corruption in all faiths!

MSMS in his Memoirs has said:

First, however, we must ask ourselves why this final and consummate appearance of the Divine Will was granted to mankind, and what were its causes. All Islamic schools of thought accept it as a fundamental principle that for centuries, for thousands of years before the advent of Mohammed, there arose from time to time messengers, illumined by Divine Grace, for and among those races of the earth which had sufficiently advanced intellectually to comprehend such a message. Thus Abraham, Moses, Jesus and all the Prophets of Israel are universally accepted by Islam. Muslims indeed know no limitation merely to the Prophets of Israel; they are ready to admit that there were similar Divinely inspired messengers in other countriesGautama Buddha, Shri Krishna and Shri Ram in India, Socrates in Greece, the wise man of China and many other sages and saints among peoples and civilizations, trace of which we have lost. Thus man's soul has never been left without a specially inspired messenger from the soul that sustains, embraces and is the universe. Then what need was there for a Divine revelation to Mohammed ?


The answer of Islam is precise and clear. In spite of its great spiritual strength, Jewish monotheism has retained two characteristics which render it essentially different from Islamic monotheism: God has remained, in spite of all, a national and racial God for the children of Israel, and His personality is entirely separate from its supreme manifestation, the Universe. In far-distant countries such as India and China, the purity of the Faith in the one God had been so vitiated by polytheism, by idolatry and even by a pantheism which was hardly distinguishable from atheism that these popular and folklore religions bore little resemblance to that which emanated from the true and pure Godhead. Christianity lost its strength and meaning for Muslims in that it saw it great and glorious founder not as a man but as God incarnate in man, as God made Flesh.

http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0016b.html

[kmaherali]

My question was in the back ground of if he is universal God then he is all powerful to solve worldly problems and stop killings of innocent peoples.

There has been disucssion on this issue including MSMS's statement at:

Pain, Suffering and Calamities
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... ht=tsunami

You may continue the discussion there...

In 56 Muslim countries mostly Muslim public is uneducated may be more than 65%. They can't read news papers, they do not have luxury of TV or internet. Mostly news papers in Muslim countries have given space to Afghanistan forum beside other main outlets of news world.

Hence they would not know who the Imam is or who Aga Khan is and therefore will not follow what he tells them!

[kmaherali]

With due respect to late Alwaiz Amlani, he was fortunate that Imam gave him audience of an hour, BUT by nature of Noor e Imamat though he is a good listener but not such emotional that he started banging his hands on table.
Imam is SABIR and can't be swayed away by some statement. .

Sometimes he chooses to show emotion to indicate the importance and significance of the issues he is dealing with. He wouldn't be swayed by any idle statement but will give emotion as a reinforcement. For example he showed emotion when he remembered his family members who passed away during the GJ Irshad Mubarak. He showed emotion when he first visited the Kampala JK after it was given back to us from the government of Uganda.

You can of course choose not to believe!

We respect ginans. They are religious, ethical, and mystic poetry/bhajans. But according to changing times farman and Hidayat changed. In Ismaili curriculum for RE students there is no mention of Hindu mythology any more. Imam is paying attention to youth, the future leaders, that's why the Hidayat for Indian jamaits is," REMEMBER ALLAH THROUGHOUT THE DAY." Imam did not used the word Vishnu, Brahma, or Rama. Why ginans are divided in 3 categories? Why just limited ginans are approved to be recited in JKs? Why ginans with deep Hindu mythology stories are prohibited to be recited? Why Hindu terminologies are changed with Muslim terminologies? These all changes happened on Hidayat of Hazar Imam.

The RE curriculum is designed for the diversity of the Jamat and hence it will not mention aspect that are particular to a segment of the Jamat.

Did the Imam himself categorize the Ginans? If not how can anybody else assume that responsibility? The changes have been made without the Imam's consent. There has not been any explicit Hidayat on any changes. We were never made aware of there being any Hidayat in this regard at the IIS. There has been discussion on this matter at:

Changes in the Ginans
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... topic&t=18

You may continue the discussion there...

[shivaathervedi]

My question was in the back ground of if he is universal God then he is all powerful to solve worldly problems and stop killings of innocent peoples.

There has been disucssion on this issue including MSMS's statement at:

Pain, Suffering and Calamities
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... ht=tsunami

You may continue the discussion there...

In 56 Muslim countries mostly Muslim public is uneducated may be more than 65%. They can't read news papers, they do not have luxury of TV or internet. Mostly news papers in Muslim countries have given space to Afghanistan forum beside other main outlets of news world.

Hence they would not know who the Imam is or who Aga Khan is and therefore will not follow what he tells them!

Did Imam sent Pir or any Ismaili of high religious caliber to these countries, did Ismailia Associations or ITREB sent any missionaries to these countries to explain them who is Imam/ Aga Khan, and what are his philanthropic contributions, or propagate Ismaili faith? I haven't seen any action in this direction.

[shivaathervedi]

With due respect to late Alwaiz Amlani, he was fortunate that Imam gave him audience of an hour, BUT by nature of Noor e Imamat though he is a good listener but not such emotional that he started banging his hands on table.
Imam is SABIR and can't be swayed away by some statement. .

Sometimes he chooses to show emotion to indicate the importance and significance of the issues he is dealing with. He wouldn't be swayed by any idle statement but will give emotion as a reinforcement. For example he showed emotion when he remembered his family members who passed away during the GJ Irshad Mubarak. He showed emotion when he first visited the Kampala JK after it was given back to us from the government of Uganda.

You can of course choose not to believe!

We respect ginans. They are religious, ethical, and mystic poetry/bhajans. But according to changing times farman and Hidayat changed. In Ismaili curriculum for RE students there is no mention of Hindu mythology any more. Imam is paying attention to youth, the future leaders, that's why the Hidayat for Indian jamaits is," REMEMBER ALLAH THROUGHOUT THE DAY." Imam did not used the word Vishnu, Brahma, or Rama. Why ginans are divided in 3 categories? Why just limited ginans are approved to be recited in JKs? Why ginans with deep Hindu mythology stories are prohibited to be recited? Why Hindu terminologies are changed with Muslim terminologies? These all changes happened on Hidayat of Hazar Imam.

The RE curriculum is designed for the diversity of the Jamat and hence it will not mention aspect that are particular to a segment of the Jamat.

Did the Imam himself categorize the Ginans? If not how can anybody else assume that responsibility? The changes have been made without the Imam's consent. There has not been any explicit Hidayat on any changes. We were never made aware of there being any Hidayat in this regard at the IIS. There has been discussion on this matter at:

Changes in the Ginans
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... topic&t=18

You may continue the discussion there...

Imam can be emotional during delivering Farman or speech, but he will not start banging table, door, or chest beating.

Ismailis are one jamait, having one Imam, and same faith. Imam is mainly attentive to youth. The courses are devised same for all RE youth in a simple way to understand Islam and Ismailism. The attention is given on Islamic and Ismaili tenets. The complicated Hindu mythology of many gods is avoided.

Obviously Imam himself will not categorize ginans, he gave Hidayat and task to chairpersons ITREBs. There were few ginan worshops in 70s/80s and changes were made with approval of Hazar Imam. There is Hidayat confined to chairpersons which on appropriate times inform the jamaits according to Hidayat.

[Admin]

changes were made with approval of Hazar Imam

Your lies have already been proven wrong with official documents. Imam never approved any changes. You will not succeed with your agenda of putting into the mouth of Imam whatever suits you. In the past also you have tried to mislead people and it has not been succesful. Don't you learn from your mistakes like other normal people do?

http://www.ismaili.net/heritage/node/31647

[ShamsB]

changes were made with approval of Hazar Imam

Your lies have already been proven wrong with official documents. Imam never approved any changes. You will not succeed with your agenda of putting into the mouth of Imam whatever suits you. In the past also you have tried to mislead people and it has not been succesful. Don't you learn from your mistakes like other normal people do?

http://www.ismaili.net/heritage/node/31647

Admin - isn't it time to shut down this thread? Maybe once again clean house?

Shams