the last thread we had on this topic was interrupted and fizzled into nothingness.
What information can anyone provide regarding the names of Imams before 632 AD, when Imamat was openly declared.
Imams Pre-Ali (continued)
YAM,
My mistake. I should have stoped people from posting irrelevant post into this subject which is also of personnal interest to many of us.
Let us all get this discussion going and trace the lineage of Imam Ali as far as we can. I will personnaly monitor the postings on this topic and delete irrelevent posting by people who do not want us to find out more about Imams before Ali.
[In fact I just did that with one message few minutes ago].
What about posting a geneology before Ali and ask people to complete wherever there is a gap?
Admin
My mistake. I should have stoped people from posting irrelevant post into this subject which is also of personnal interest to many of us.
Let us all get this discussion going and trace the lineage of Imam Ali as far as we can. I will personnaly monitor the postings on this topic and delete irrelevent posting by people who do not want us to find out more about Imams before Ali.
[In fact I just did that with one message few minutes ago].
What about posting a geneology before Ali and ask people to complete wherever there is a gap?
Admin
YAM,
Yes, Admin, it would be good if you could post a genealogy of Ali.
The question is..which genealogy will you post?
1. There is the one given in the old dua, which contains gaps.
2. There is the one used by other non-ismailies, which is basicaly the descendants of Ishmael down to Ali, but this genealogy does not include Aaron and Simon Peter as being Imams.
In this issue of Imamat, let us make 4 categories:
1. pre-biblical Imams - refers to Imams before Prophet Adam 4000 BC.
2. biblical Imams - refers to Imams between Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus
3. post-biblical Imams - refers to Imams between Prophet Jesus and Prophet Muhammad
4. manifest Imams - refers to Imams after Hazat Ali (we know all there names)
Admin, plz post ANY info regarding any of this, the more the better!
Yes, Admin, it would be good if you could post a genealogy of Ali.
The question is..which genealogy will you post?
1. There is the one given in the old dua, which contains gaps.
2. There is the one used by other non-ismailies, which is basicaly the descendants of Ishmael down to Ali, but this genealogy does not include Aaron and Simon Peter as being Imams.
In this issue of Imamat, let us make 4 categories:
1. pre-biblical Imams - refers to Imams before Prophet Adam 4000 BC.
2. biblical Imams - refers to Imams between Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus
3. post-biblical Imams - refers to Imams between Prophet Jesus and Prophet Muhammad
4. manifest Imams - refers to Imams after Hazat Ali (we know all there names)
Admin, plz post ANY info regarding any of this, the more the better!
I know that we Ismailies accept that each Natiq Prophet was accompanied by a Silent Imam, (ie: Ali).
Adam who's Imam was his son Seth
Noah who's Imam was his son Shem
Abraham who's Imam was his son Ishmael
Moses who's Imam was Aaron
Jesus who's Imam was Simon Peter
Muhammad who's Imam was Ali
The Problems:
Seth, Shem, Ishmael, and Ali were all DIRECT DESCENDANTS of each other, so, no problem there. BUT, Aaron is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael, and Simon Peter is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael or Aaron.
This means that either:
1. before Ali, Imamat did not pass by heredity
2. Simon and Aaron were NOT genuine Imams.
Adam who's Imam was his son Seth
Noah who's Imam was his son Shem
Abraham who's Imam was his son Ishmael
Moses who's Imam was Aaron
Jesus who's Imam was Simon Peter
Muhammad who's Imam was Ali
The Problems:
Seth, Shem, Ishmael, and Ali were all DIRECT DESCENDANTS of each other, so, no problem there. BUT, Aaron is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael, and Simon Peter is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael or Aaron.
This means that either:
1. before Ali, Imamat did not pass by heredity
2. Simon and Aaron were NOT genuine Imams.
Possible Reconciliations of Problems
The Problems:
Seth, Shem, Ishmael, and Ali were all DIRECT DESCENDANTS of each other, so, no problem there. BUT, Aaron is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael, and Simon Peter is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael or Aaron.
This means that either:
1. before Ali, Imamat did not pass by heredity
OR
2. Simon and Aaron were NOT genuine Imams.
Despite these INCONSISTENCIES, I have come up with a number of "theories" which speculate, how this Imamat could have been passed on during pre-islamic times.
Theory #1: Imamat ONLY passes by heredity.
This hereditary line of Imams is the Mustaqarr (Permanent) line of Imams. The line of Imamat went through Seth, Shem, and Ishmael. Then it descended through Ishmael's progeny, until it became manifest with Hazrat Ali and it continues manifest through Ali's descendents. This theory indicates that Haroon (Aaron) and Shamun (Simon) were not actual Imams, and merely assistants to their respective Prophets.
Theory #2: Imamat did NOT have to pass by heredity, but must be with the descendants of Abraham, and there must be a continuity.
In this model, Seth, Shem, and Ishmael were the true Imams. The challenge is to figure out how Aaron would become an Imam later on. At this time, we should note that Moses, before receiving revelation, went to live and sought advice from Jethro - the Priest of Midian. Midian was probably Medina, and it was highly probably that Jethro was a direct descendant of Ishmael. Moses would then marry the daugher of Jethro, thus connecting the line of Isaac with the line of Ishmael. Thus, we have the Imamat passing from Jethro (house of Ishmael), to Aaron (house of Isaac). This might be acceptable since both were righteous sons of Abraham. This means that Aaron was a genuine Imam, and evidence of the Torah shows that Aaron was made the High Priest and this Priesthood would continue among Aaron's descendants. Biblical High Priesthood is really the same office as the Islamic Imamat. We then must figure out how Simon Peter became the Imam. My answer to this is that he probably was not. Modern evidence shows that Yakub (James the Just), the brother of Jesus and his flesh and blood was the head of Jesus' family, designated successor by Jesus himself, and was the head of the Jerusalem church. Also, Jesus and James were direct descendants of Aaron the Priest, therefore it makes sense for the Imamat to reach James through Aaron's descendants. After the death of James and the destruction of Jerusalem, it is a fact that James' descendants fled to Arabia. It was probably in this situation, where the Imamat was secrety returned to the descendants of Ishmael, and it finally became manifest in Hazrat Ali in 632 AD.
These are my personal theories based on my research. Any comments are appreciated.
Seth, Shem, Ishmael, and Ali were all DIRECT DESCENDANTS of each other, so, no problem there. BUT, Aaron is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael, and Simon Peter is NOT a direct descendant of Ishmael or Aaron.
This means that either:
1. before Ali, Imamat did not pass by heredity
OR
2. Simon and Aaron were NOT genuine Imams.
Despite these INCONSISTENCIES, I have come up with a number of "theories" which speculate, how this Imamat could have been passed on during pre-islamic times.
Theory #1: Imamat ONLY passes by heredity.
This hereditary line of Imams is the Mustaqarr (Permanent) line of Imams. The line of Imamat went through Seth, Shem, and Ishmael. Then it descended through Ishmael's progeny, until it became manifest with Hazrat Ali and it continues manifest through Ali's descendents. This theory indicates that Haroon (Aaron) and Shamun (Simon) were not actual Imams, and merely assistants to their respective Prophets.
Theory #2: Imamat did NOT have to pass by heredity, but must be with the descendants of Abraham, and there must be a continuity.
In this model, Seth, Shem, and Ishmael were the true Imams. The challenge is to figure out how Aaron would become an Imam later on. At this time, we should note that Moses, before receiving revelation, went to live and sought advice from Jethro - the Priest of Midian. Midian was probably Medina, and it was highly probably that Jethro was a direct descendant of Ishmael. Moses would then marry the daugher of Jethro, thus connecting the line of Isaac with the line of Ishmael. Thus, we have the Imamat passing from Jethro (house of Ishmael), to Aaron (house of Isaac). This might be acceptable since both were righteous sons of Abraham. This means that Aaron was a genuine Imam, and evidence of the Torah shows that Aaron was made the High Priest and this Priesthood would continue among Aaron's descendants. Biblical High Priesthood is really the same office as the Islamic Imamat. We then must figure out how Simon Peter became the Imam. My answer to this is that he probably was not. Modern evidence shows that Yakub (James the Just), the brother of Jesus and his flesh and blood was the head of Jesus' family, designated successor by Jesus himself, and was the head of the Jerusalem church. Also, Jesus and James were direct descendants of Aaron the Priest, therefore it makes sense for the Imamat to reach James through Aaron's descendants. After the death of James and the destruction of Jerusalem, it is a fact that James' descendants fled to Arabia. It was probably in this situation, where the Imamat was secrety returned to the descendants of Ishmael, and it finally became manifest in Hazrat Ali in 632 AD.
These are my personal theories based on my research. Any comments are appreciated.
-
altaf_rupani
- Posts: 11
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THE ID - ALTAF_RUPANI HAS BEEN BANNED FROM POSTING.
Last edited by altaf_rupani on Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
Here is a clue:
Aaroon was a genuine Imam.
To be consider Jew your mother has to be a Jew. To be considered Arab, your father has to be an Arab.
So the progeny of an Arab from the descent of Ismail would be Imam even though his mother may have been born Jew and may have remarried later to a Jew after giving birth to a son called Haroon/Aaroon who would be considered both Jew and Arab.
And of course his half brother born later and called Moses [from same mother but not same father] would be Jew only. There is a verse in the Bible that does say that Aaroon was burried by his own people like Moses was buried by his own people. So both were from a different community..
Nagib
Aaroon was a genuine Imam.
To be consider Jew your mother has to be a Jew. To be considered Arab, your father has to be an Arab.
So the progeny of an Arab from the descent of Ismail would be Imam even though his mother may have been born Jew and may have remarried later to a Jew after giving birth to a son called Haroon/Aaroon who would be considered both Jew and Arab.
And of course his half brother born later and called Moses [from same mother but not same father] would be Jew only. There is a verse in the Bible that does say that Aaroon was burried by his own people like Moses was buried by his own people. So both were from a different community..
Nagib
-
altaf_rupani
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2003 12:50 pm
THE ID - ALTAF_RUPANI HAS BEEN BANNED FROM POSTING.
Last edited by altaf_rupani on Mon Jul 21, 2003 3:31 am, edited 2 times in total.
I did some research on this subject 20 years ago when I was teaching Ismaili Philosophy in the Dharmic class held by the then Ismailia Association. I did 3 papers on the subject, one on Imamat of Aaroon and his progeny, the other on Melchisedek and the third bulkier on Imams before H. Ali from various sources, going back before the last Adam's cycle. Unfortunately it is a long time ago.kandani wrote:Nagib,
thank you for taht valuable information..my next question to you would be...WHO was Aaron's father? and how was he descended from Ismail?
I have read that Aaron and Moses both descend from Levi, the son of Jacob, son of Isaac, son of Abraham. Thus, Aaron's family are called Levites.
I have traced back one on Melchisedek and will ask the Heritage people to add to the site once it is encoded. All those papers were written in French and I hope you would be able to make some sense out of them because unfortunately it is not possible for me to translate them into English.
Nagib
Heres the info i found on Melchizedek, anyting you wish to add would me helpful:
Genesis 14:
18 And Melchizedek King of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the Priest—IMAM of God Most High (Hebrew: El-Elyon, Arabic: Al-Aliyyun).
19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram (Abraham) of God Most High possessor of heaven and earth:
20 And blessed be the God Most High, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And Abram gave him tithes of all.
21 And the king of Sodom said unto Abram, Give me the persons, and take the goods to thyself.
22 And Abram said to the king of Sodom, “I have lift up MINE HAND unto the LORD, God Most High, the possessor of heaven and earth,”
Hebrews 7:
1 This Melchizedek was King of Salem (ISLAM) Priest—IMAM of God Most High (El-Elyon). He met Abraham returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him,
2 And Abraham gave him a tenth (ZAKAT) of everything. First, his name means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace” (Islam means Peace)
3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, WITHOUT BEGINNING OF DAYS OR END OF LIFE, but made (Divine) like the Son of God, HE REMAINS A PRIEST—IMAM FOREVER.
This tradition is recorded by the first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus in his book, The Great Roman-Jewish War. Josephus writes:
"But he who first built (the city of Jerusalem) was a potent man among the Canaanites, and is in our tongue called Melchizedek, 'The Righteous King', for such he really was; on which account he was (there) the first priest of God, and first built a temple (there), and called the city Jerusalem, which was formerly called Salem."
The Dead Scrolls A New Translation
Wise, Abegg & Cook pp. 455 457:
“For our author MELCHIZEDEK is an enormously EXALTED DIVINE Being, to whom ARE APPLIED NAMES that are generally RESERVED FOR GOD ALONE, THE HEBREW NAMES EL AND ELOHIM.”
"MELCHIZEDEK IS SUBSTITUTED EVEN FOR THE MOST HOLY NAME OF ISRAEL'S GOD, YAHWEH. YET MORE REMARKABLY, MELCHIZEDEK IS SAID TO ATONE FOR THE SINS OF THE RIGHTEOUS AND TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT UPON THE WICKED ACTIONS USUALLY ASSOCIATED WITH GOD HIMSELF. BY THE POWER OF MELCHIZEDEK, dominion on earth shall pass from Satan (here called belial) to the righteous SONS OF LIGHT. This latter group constitutes those who are predestined to belong to the PARTY OF MELCHIZEDEK, the congregation of the sons of righteousness. These people heed the message of a second figure described in this writing as the MESSENGER. The messenger, also designated ANOINTED OF THE SPIRIT (Messiah), is conceived of as coming with a message from god, a message explicating the course of history (that is, a declaration of when the end shall come) and teaching about god's truths. This figure dies, an event that may correspond somehow with the text's references to jubilee periods.
Isaiah 52:7 “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of THE MESSENGER who announces PEACE, who brings GOOD NEWS, who announces SALVATION, who says to Zion "Your divine being (Melchizedek) reigns.”
Isaiah 61:2 “to proclaim the year of the LORD`s favour, the day of the vengeance of our God; to COMFORT all who mourn”
Psalms 7:7,8 “Over it take your seat in the highest heaven; A divine being (Melchizedek) will judge the peoples”
Psalms 82:1 “A godlike being (Melchizedek) has taken his place in the council of God; in the midst of divine beings he holds judgement”
Genesis 14:
18 And Melchizedek King of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the Priest—IMAM of God Most High (Hebrew: El-Elyon, Arabic: Al-Aliyyun).
19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram (Abraham) of God Most High possessor of heaven and earth:
20 And blessed be the God Most High, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And Abram gave him tithes of all.
21 And the king of Sodom said unto Abram, Give me the persons, and take the goods to thyself.
22 And Abram said to the king of Sodom, “I have lift up MINE HAND unto the LORD, God Most High, the possessor of heaven and earth,”
Hebrews 7:
1 This Melchizedek was King of Salem (ISLAM) Priest—IMAM of God Most High (El-Elyon). He met Abraham returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him,
2 And Abraham gave him a tenth (ZAKAT) of everything. First, his name means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace” (Islam means Peace)
3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, WITHOUT BEGINNING OF DAYS OR END OF LIFE, but made (Divine) like the Son of God, HE REMAINS A PRIEST—IMAM FOREVER.
This tradition is recorded by the first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus in his book, The Great Roman-Jewish War. Josephus writes:
"But he who first built (the city of Jerusalem) was a potent man among the Canaanites, and is in our tongue called Melchizedek, 'The Righteous King', for such he really was; on which account he was (there) the first priest of God, and first built a temple (there), and called the city Jerusalem, which was formerly called Salem."
The Dead Scrolls A New Translation
Wise, Abegg & Cook pp. 455 457:
“For our author MELCHIZEDEK is an enormously EXALTED DIVINE Being, to whom ARE APPLIED NAMES that are generally RESERVED FOR GOD ALONE, THE HEBREW NAMES EL AND ELOHIM.”
"MELCHIZEDEK IS SUBSTITUTED EVEN FOR THE MOST HOLY NAME OF ISRAEL'S GOD, YAHWEH. YET MORE REMARKABLY, MELCHIZEDEK IS SAID TO ATONE FOR THE SINS OF THE RIGHTEOUS AND TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT UPON THE WICKED ACTIONS USUALLY ASSOCIATED WITH GOD HIMSELF. BY THE POWER OF MELCHIZEDEK, dominion on earth shall pass from Satan (here called belial) to the righteous SONS OF LIGHT. This latter group constitutes those who are predestined to belong to the PARTY OF MELCHIZEDEK, the congregation of the sons of righteousness. These people heed the message of a second figure described in this writing as the MESSENGER. The messenger, also designated ANOINTED OF THE SPIRIT (Messiah), is conceived of as coming with a message from god, a message explicating the course of history (that is, a declaration of when the end shall come) and teaching about god's truths. This figure dies, an event that may correspond somehow with the text's references to jubilee periods.
Isaiah 52:7 “How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of THE MESSENGER who announces PEACE, who brings GOOD NEWS, who announces SALVATION, who says to Zion "Your divine being (Melchizedek) reigns.”
Isaiah 61:2 “to proclaim the year of the LORD`s favour, the day of the vengeance of our God; to COMFORT all who mourn”
Psalms 7:7,8 “Over it take your seat in the highest heaven; A divine being (Melchizedek) will judge the peoples”
Psalms 82:1 “A godlike being (Melchizedek) has taken his place in the council of God; in the midst of divine beings he holds judgement”
Let me spell it out for you:
- Muhammad said Ali is like Aaron
- Ali is Imam
- therefore...Aaron is Imam
- Torah says Aaron was the High Priest
- therefore...Imam is equivalent to High Priest
ALSO:
- Prophet Abraham was blessed by High Priest Melchizedek
- Prophet Abraham paid dasond to High Priest Melchizedek
- thus, High Priest Melchizedek is SUPERIOR to Prophet Abraham
- only thing superior to a Prophet is the Imam
- Melchizedek lives forever
- Imam spiritually lives forever
- Melchizedek's islamic name, Malik-ul Salaam, is mentioned as Imam in the Asal Dua.
- Scripture says Melchizedek will be announced by the last Messenger of God
- Muhammad, Messenger of God, announced Imamat of Ali
- thus, Melchizedek is spiritually Ali
****therefore....Melchizedek was an Imam****
- Muhammad said Ali is like Aaron
- Ali is Imam
- therefore...Aaron is Imam
- Torah says Aaron was the High Priest
- therefore...Imam is equivalent to High Priest
ALSO:
- Prophet Abraham was blessed by High Priest Melchizedek
- Prophet Abraham paid dasond to High Priest Melchizedek
- thus, High Priest Melchizedek is SUPERIOR to Prophet Abraham
- only thing superior to a Prophet is the Imam
- Melchizedek lives forever
- Imam spiritually lives forever
- Melchizedek's islamic name, Malik-ul Salaam, is mentioned as Imam in the Asal Dua.
- Scripture says Melchizedek will be announced by the last Messenger of God
- Muhammad, Messenger of God, announced Imamat of Ali
- thus, Melchizedek is spiritually Ali
****therefore....Melchizedek was an Imam****
I have cleaned this thread of all irrelevant messages. Anyone who know anything about Imams of the periode preceeding H. Ali please post here. All other people, do not post here.
I was told today that there is one farman in which Sultan Muhammad Shah says that prophet Moise requested Hazrat Aaroon to sit on the Takhat [Throne]. Can we trace back that source? Thanks
ADMIN
-------------------------------------------
I was told today that there is one farman in which Sultan Muhammad Shah says that prophet Moise requested Hazrat Aaroon to sit on the Takhat [Throne]. Can we trace back that source? Thanks
ADMIN
-------------------------------------------
Last edited by Admin on Sun Jul 20, 2003 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
star_munir
- Posts: 1670
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- Contact:
THE BEARER OF
THE NOOR- E-ALI (SHRI VISHNU)
1. shri ahunah, 2. shri alakh, 3. shri naamnil,
period of 4. shri anil, 5. shri soon, 6. shri saan,
three 7. shri naan, 8. shri ginan, 9. shri noor,
'karans' 10. shri tej, 11. shri jal, 12. shri kamal,
13. shri adbudh, 14. shri jaag, 15. shri tantaw,
16. shri premtantaw, 17. shri aad furush,
(shri brahma ) --- incarnation of "the nabi,"
(shri ahunad aad ) the "noor" was in batin
(shri avigat aad) )
period of four 'kalaps'
1. shri haw, 2. shri kaw, 3. shri dharam
4. shri keshaw, 5. shri tawnaad, 6. shri utra,
7. shri haritak, 8. shri pururwa, 9. shri anta atita,
10. shri premrukh,
period of four 'yugas' (das avtar)
shri maccha
1. manaek, 2. ajamil 3. agarsen,
4. ochhaut, 5 . bharesp at, 6. asvamitar,
7 . pautar, 8. padwir,
shri korabh
9. bhisriyat, 10 . dikhiyat, 11. prajapat,
12. agarsen, 13 . kadim, 14. doel,
shri varah,
'patra 77' 15. keshav, 16. khatrivash, 17. asaaw,
the bearers 18. unas, 19. khalifat, 20. gotam,
of the 21. anta shri vishnu 22. haritak,
"noor-e-ali"
shri narshinha,
23. manaek, 24 . kauchak, 25. repak,
26. keshvadhan, 27. keshvarukh,
shri vaeman
2 8. maandhata, 29. prathmijay,
30. jaesrin, 31. javlagan,
shri farsiram
32. roog, 33 . noog, 34 . ju jeaat, 35. kumbra,
36. alif, 3 7 . ajepaal, 38. dashrath,
shri ram,
39. padam, 40. jashvadhan, 41. virpaar, 42. vaasudev,
shri krishna (ka' an),
43. parikhshat, 44. janmejay, 45. shesanand, 46. satanand,
47. swas than, 48. budsthan, 49. vinvachhraaj,
shri budha (adam),
50. shish (seth), 51. sham, 52. salaam, 53. malkaan,
54. eslaam, 55. haroon, 56. shamunnsaffa (simon peter),
57. adnaan, 58. maa' d, 59. nizar, 60. mudar,
61. eliaas, 62. mudrak, 63. khuzema, 64. kinan,
65. nazar, 66. maalek, 67. fahar, 68. gaaleb,
69. luve, 70. ka'ab, 71. mure, 72. kilaab,
73. kus e, 74. abdul munaaf, 75. abu hasham,
76. abdul mutlib, 77Abu Taleb
-
shri naklanki mowla murtaza ali
Names of) Vishnu's ancestors:
. 1. mowlana 'Aly; 2. mowlana Husayn; 3. mowlana Zainil 'Abideen; 4. mowlana Muhammadinil Baqir; 5. mowlana Ja'faris Sadiq; 6. mowlana Ismail; 7. mowlana Muhmmad bin Ismail,
8. mowlana Wafi Ahmed; 9. mowlana Taqi Muhammad; 10. mowlana Raziyiddeen Abdillah; 11. mowlana Muhammadinil Mahdi; 12. mowlana Qaim; 13. mowlana Mansoor; 14. mowlana Mu'izz;
15. mowlana Aziz; 16. mowlana Hakim bi Amrillah; 17. mowlana Zahir; 18. mowlana Mustansiribillah; 19. mowlana Nizar; 20. mowlana Hadi: 21. mowlana Muhtadi,
. 22. mowlana Qahir: 23.mowlana 'Ala Zikrihis-Salaam; 24. mowlana A'ala Muhammad; 25. mowlana Jalaliddeen Hasan; 26. mowlana 'Ala-iddeen Muhammad; 27. mowlana Rukniddeen Khairi Shah; 28. mowlana Shamsiddeen Muhammad;
29. mowlana Qasim Shah; 30. mowlana Islam Shah; 31. mowlana Muhammad bin Islam Shah; 32. mowlana Mustansiri-billah; 33. mowlana Abdis-Salaam; 34. mowlana Ghareeb Meerza; 35. mowlana Abizzar Aly:
36. mowlana Murad Meerza; 37. mowlana Zulfiqar Aly; 38. mowlana Nooridden Aly; 39. mowlana Khalilillahi Aly; 40. mowlana Nizar; 41. mowlana Sayyid Aly; 42. mowlana Hasan Aly;
. 43. mowlana Qasim Aly; 44. mowlana Abul Hasan Aly; 45. mowlana Khalilillahi Aly; 46. mowlana Shah Hasan Aly; 47. mowlana Shah 'Aly Shah; 48. mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah.
49. mowlana shah karim al-husseini imam-e-zaman
(he is himself the "noor-e-ali," mowla murtaza ali)
THE NOOR- E-ALI (SHRI VISHNU)
1. shri ahunah, 2. shri alakh, 3. shri naamnil,
period of 4. shri anil, 5. shri soon, 6. shri saan,
three 7. shri naan, 8. shri ginan, 9. shri noor,
'karans' 10. shri tej, 11. shri jal, 12. shri kamal,
13. shri adbudh, 14. shri jaag, 15. shri tantaw,
16. shri premtantaw, 17. shri aad furush,
(shri brahma ) --- incarnation of "the nabi,"
(shri ahunad aad ) the "noor" was in batin
(shri avigat aad) )
period of four 'kalaps'
1. shri haw, 2. shri kaw, 3. shri dharam
4. shri keshaw, 5. shri tawnaad, 6. shri utra,
7. shri haritak, 8. shri pururwa, 9. shri anta atita,
10. shri premrukh,
period of four 'yugas' (das avtar)
shri maccha
1. manaek, 2. ajamil 3. agarsen,
4. ochhaut, 5 . bharesp at, 6. asvamitar,
7 . pautar, 8. padwir,
shri korabh
9. bhisriyat, 10 . dikhiyat, 11. prajapat,
12. agarsen, 13 . kadim, 14. doel,
shri varah,
'patra 77' 15. keshav, 16. khatrivash, 17. asaaw,
the bearers 18. unas, 19. khalifat, 20. gotam,
of the 21. anta shri vishnu 22. haritak,
"noor-e-ali"
shri narshinha,
23. manaek, 24 . kauchak, 25. repak,
26. keshvadhan, 27. keshvarukh,
shri vaeman
2 8. maandhata, 29. prathmijay,
30. jaesrin, 31. javlagan,
shri farsiram
32. roog, 33 . noog, 34 . ju jeaat, 35. kumbra,
36. alif, 3 7 . ajepaal, 38. dashrath,
shri ram,
39. padam, 40. jashvadhan, 41. virpaar, 42. vaasudev,
shri krishna (ka' an),
43. parikhshat, 44. janmejay, 45. shesanand, 46. satanand,
47. swas than, 48. budsthan, 49. vinvachhraaj,
shri budha (adam),
50. shish (seth), 51. sham, 52. salaam, 53. malkaan,
54. eslaam, 55. haroon, 56. shamunnsaffa (simon peter),
57. adnaan, 58. maa' d, 59. nizar, 60. mudar,
61. eliaas, 62. mudrak, 63. khuzema, 64. kinan,
65. nazar, 66. maalek, 67. fahar, 68. gaaleb,
69. luve, 70. ka'ab, 71. mure, 72. kilaab,
73. kus e, 74. abdul munaaf, 75. abu hasham,
76. abdul mutlib, 77Abu Taleb
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shri naklanki mowla murtaza ali
Names of) Vishnu's ancestors:
. 1. mowlana 'Aly; 2. mowlana Husayn; 3. mowlana Zainil 'Abideen; 4. mowlana Muhammadinil Baqir; 5. mowlana Ja'faris Sadiq; 6. mowlana Ismail; 7. mowlana Muhmmad bin Ismail,
8. mowlana Wafi Ahmed; 9. mowlana Taqi Muhammad; 10. mowlana Raziyiddeen Abdillah; 11. mowlana Muhammadinil Mahdi; 12. mowlana Qaim; 13. mowlana Mansoor; 14. mowlana Mu'izz;
15. mowlana Aziz; 16. mowlana Hakim bi Amrillah; 17. mowlana Zahir; 18. mowlana Mustansiribillah; 19. mowlana Nizar; 20. mowlana Hadi: 21. mowlana Muhtadi,
. 22. mowlana Qahir: 23.mowlana 'Ala Zikrihis-Salaam; 24. mowlana A'ala Muhammad; 25. mowlana Jalaliddeen Hasan; 26. mowlana 'Ala-iddeen Muhammad; 27. mowlana Rukniddeen Khairi Shah; 28. mowlana Shamsiddeen Muhammad;
29. mowlana Qasim Shah; 30. mowlana Islam Shah; 31. mowlana Muhammad bin Islam Shah; 32. mowlana Mustansiri-billah; 33. mowlana Abdis-Salaam; 34. mowlana Ghareeb Meerza; 35. mowlana Abizzar Aly:
36. mowlana Murad Meerza; 37. mowlana Zulfiqar Aly; 38. mowlana Nooridden Aly; 39. mowlana Khalilillahi Aly; 40. mowlana Nizar; 41. mowlana Sayyid Aly; 42. mowlana Hasan Aly;
. 43. mowlana Qasim Aly; 44. mowlana Abul Hasan Aly; 45. mowlana Khalilillahi Aly; 46. mowlana Shah Hasan Aly; 47. mowlana Shah 'Aly Shah; 48. mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah.
49. mowlana shah karim al-husseini imam-e-zaman
(he is himself the "noor-e-ali," mowla murtaza ali)
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arshad1988
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As Pir Hassan Kabirdin in Anant Akhado says:
Aashaajee Ragtaa pechaa karsanaa setaa
cho varannaa juga huaa jee
avar rang tera bahu chhaaje
isme-thi chaar sujaataa.................Haree anant...24
Oh Lord Red, yellow, black & white
There have been four ages represented by the four
colours (each with distinct habits and social customs)
You have many other colours which are beautiful
out of these I know four.
Haree You are eternal...
Here is verse 364 of Moman Chetamni
Eji Alakh nirinjan ae narji kahiae
Teni kala nooon nahi koie paas
Aad uniyad thi ae narji kahiae
Teni khel ramat che jugajug saar
Cheto...
364. The Creator of this universe is Him and how can I describe His attributes. He is the Beginning and He is the End and He has come in different eras and different forms
Aashaajee Ragtaa pechaa karsanaa setaa
cho varannaa juga huaa jee
avar rang tera bahu chhaaje
isme-thi chaar sujaataa.................Haree anant...24
Oh Lord Red, yellow, black & white
There have been four ages represented by the four
colours (each with distinct habits and social customs)
You have many other colours which are beautiful
out of these I know four.
Haree You are eternal...
Here is verse 364 of Moman Chetamni
Eji Alakh nirinjan ae narji kahiae
Teni kala nooon nahi koie paas
Aad uniyad thi ae narji kahiae
Teni khel ramat che jugajug saar
Cheto...
364. The Creator of this universe is Him and how can I describe His attributes. He is the Beginning and He is the End and He has come in different eras and different forms
Aaron, Melchisedek
This article written in 1984 is in French on the Imamat of Mowlana Melchisedek (Malik ul Salaam)
http://www.ismaili.net/Source/1294b.html
The following one is on the Imamat of Hazrat Aaron
http://www.ismaili.net/Source/1294c.html
http://www.ismaili.net/Source/1294b.html
The following one is on the Imamat of Hazrat Aaron
http://www.ismaili.net/Source/1294c.html