Hazar Imam Shah Karim is Mazhar of Allah.kmaherali wrote:You mean that the Imam could call himself Karim one day and mazhar the following day?mazharshah wrote: Yes, Avtars came in disguise of different names in yugas.
Facing Kaba'a
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mazharshah_1
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mazharshah_1
- Posts: 35
- Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:40 pm
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mazharshah_1
- Posts: 35
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Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.kmaherali wrote:48 names represent different Imams in different contexts. I ask you again does the present Imam call himself Karim today, Peter tomorrow and John the day after like you do?mazharshah wrote: In 6th part of Du'a we recite 48 different names of Ali ( two comes twice).
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.
Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
Clever! You have to distinguish titles from the names. By what titles he is known or called is different than calling himself different names as you say you do. Hence the Imam is not your role model as you say.mazharshah wrote: Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.
Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
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mazharshah_1
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Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".kmaherali wrote:Clever! You have to distinguish titles from the names. By what titles he is known or called is different than calling himself different names as you say you do. Hence the Imam is not your role model as you say.mazharshah wrote: Ismailis believe all Imams are Ali. So Noor e Ali is one but has different names in different eras. like in 4 Jugs he adopted various names. The last but not the least is Naklanki.
We Ismailis call or remember Imam with various names as, Ali, Shah Karim, Hazar Imam, PirShah, Pir Karim, Saheb e Zaman, Ulil Amr, Dhani Salamat, Sahebul Asr, Nijatul mou'mineen wal mou'minaat and so on.
Regarding myself, I was unknown, when became known adopted various names.
MON KEESTAM, MON KEESTAM
HANUZ DAR TAHIYUR MANDAH UM
MON KEESTAM
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
I was just pointing out that he is at least not your role model because you do not follow his example.mazharshah wrote:Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
But more generally he cannot be our model because for us he is born pure and does not need further purification and his role is unique as a guide. We on the other hand need to purify ourselves and hence we have different roles to play
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mazharshah_1
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Am I so worthy that Imam will adopt my model!! I am nothing.kmaherali wrote:I was just pointing out that he is at least not your role model because you do not follow his example.mazharshah wrote:Hazar Imam is a role model. Look, what Deborah Yedlin chancellor of Calgary University said about Hazar Imam. She said," Aga Khan a MODEL for us all".
When world dignitaries say Imam is role model, why are we shying to accept him a role model.
But more generally he cannot be our model because for us he is born pure and does not need further purification and his role is unique as a guide. We on the other hand need to purify ourselves and hence we have different roles to play
Imam was born pure as you wrote, therefore he can't be God according to LUM YALID WA LUM YULAD. He who is born can't be God. I know you will play NOOR NOOR record.
Yes Ismailis follow the pure model so that they should be purified.
I am pointing out to you that he is not your role model because he does not change his name to hide his identity like you do.mazharshah wrote:Am I so worthy that Imam will adopt my model!! I am nothing. Imam was born pure as you wrote, therefore he can't be God according to LUM YALID WA LUM YULAD. He who is born can't be God. I know you will play NOOR NOOR record.
Yes Ismailis follow the pure model so that they should be purified.
I have never suggested you to be worthy of being a role model.
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shivatrivedi
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kmaherali wrote:
I am pointing out to you that he is not your role model because he does not change his name to hide his identity like you do.
I have never suggested you to be worthy of being a role model.[/quote]
Reply:
MON AANEM KE MON DANEM. I know what I am.
Never claimed to be a role model, though in future few will adopt my role model on Heritage. (my replacement)
Dus Avtars have Dus (ten) different names and Shiva has 108 attribute names. From Ali to Karim all Imams have different names except 2.
I am pointing out to you that he is not your role model because he does not change his name to hide his identity like you do.
I have never suggested you to be worthy of being a role model.[/quote]
Reply:
MON AANEM KE MON DANEM. I know what I am.
Never claimed to be a role model, though in future few will adopt my role model on Heritage. (my replacement)
Dus Avtars have Dus (ten) different names and Shiva has 108 attribute names. From Ali to Karim all Imams have different names except 2.
Sikh Missionary Society: Publications: Guru Nanak (for Children):
A Journey to Mecca
Guru Nanak sleeping
Guru Nanak now set out to Mecca in Arabia. Mecca is the holy place of the Muslims. The Guru travelled to Surat, a small seaport near Bombay. From there, Guru Nanak and Mardana went to Arabia in a ship. After a few weeks they reached Mecca. There is a very big Mosque in Mecca. Guru Nanak and Mardana were very tired after long travels. They went to the mosque and lay down to take rest. Guru Nanak's feet were towards the Kaaba in the mosque. The Kaaba is a room in the middle of the mosque and is called, 'The house of God (Allah).'
A man named Rukandin was the priest of the Kaaba. He came out and saw Guru Nanak's feet towards the Kaba. He was very angry. He at once shouted. "Don't you know this is the house of God, you fool? Why are you lying with your feet towards the Kaaba?"
Guru Nanak woke up. He said, "O sir, I'm sorry I didn't know it. I was tired so I just lay down and fell asleep. Could you turn my legs to the side in which there's no God?"
Rukandin at once caught hold of his legs and dragged them to the other side. He saw that the Kaaba still stood before Guru Nanak's feet. Then he gave another pull but to his great surprise, he saw the Kaaba again towards the Guru's feet. He was so upset that he could not speak.
Guru Nanak said, "Rukandin. God does not live in one place. He lives everywhere." Saying this, Guru Nanak and Mardana started singing hymns. A crowd of people gathered around them. They called Guru Nanak, 'Baba Nanak'. 'Baba' means an old and wise man.
After a few days they went to Medina and Baghdad. At Baghdad a Muslim saint Behlol met the Guru. They had a long talk and became friends. Behlol asked Baba Nanak, "What is your idea of God?"
Guru Nanak replied, "There is one God. He is True. He makes everything. He is not afraid of anyone. He is not born. He never dies. He is self-made. We need only think of Him and pray to Him."
Behlol liked the Guru's teaching very much. He travelled a lot and told the people about this idea of Guru. After some time Guru Nanak and Mardana came back to the Punjab.
https://www.sikhmissionarysociety.org/s ... /chapter6/
A Journey to Mecca
Guru Nanak sleeping
Guru Nanak now set out to Mecca in Arabia. Mecca is the holy place of the Muslims. The Guru travelled to Surat, a small seaport near Bombay. From there, Guru Nanak and Mardana went to Arabia in a ship. After a few weeks they reached Mecca. There is a very big Mosque in Mecca. Guru Nanak and Mardana were very tired after long travels. They went to the mosque and lay down to take rest. Guru Nanak's feet were towards the Kaaba in the mosque. The Kaaba is a room in the middle of the mosque and is called, 'The house of God (Allah).'
A man named Rukandin was the priest of the Kaaba. He came out and saw Guru Nanak's feet towards the Kaba. He was very angry. He at once shouted. "Don't you know this is the house of God, you fool? Why are you lying with your feet towards the Kaaba?"
Guru Nanak woke up. He said, "O sir, I'm sorry I didn't know it. I was tired so I just lay down and fell asleep. Could you turn my legs to the side in which there's no God?"
Rukandin at once caught hold of his legs and dragged them to the other side. He saw that the Kaaba still stood before Guru Nanak's feet. Then he gave another pull but to his great surprise, he saw the Kaaba again towards the Guru's feet. He was so upset that he could not speak.
Guru Nanak said, "Rukandin. God does not live in one place. He lives everywhere." Saying this, Guru Nanak and Mardana started singing hymns. A crowd of people gathered around them. They called Guru Nanak, 'Baba Nanak'. 'Baba' means an old and wise man.
After a few days they went to Medina and Baghdad. At Baghdad a Muslim saint Behlol met the Guru. They had a long talk and became friends. Behlol asked Baba Nanak, "What is your idea of God?"
Guru Nanak replied, "There is one God. He is True. He makes everything. He is not afraid of anyone. He is not born. He never dies. He is self-made. We need only think of Him and pray to Him."
Behlol liked the Guru's teaching very much. He travelled a lot and told the people about this idea of Guru. After some time Guru Nanak and Mardana came back to the Punjab.
https://www.sikhmissionarysociety.org/s ... /chapter6/
Baba Nanak Shrine, a Sikh Gurdwara in Baghdad, Iraq, which was rediscovered by Sikh soldiers during World War I and was repaired and rebuilt during World War II, by Sikh soldiers again, existed till 2003 in somewhat good shape.
The founder of the Sikh religion, Guru Nanak, came to Baghdad in the early sixteenth century, around 1511 AD after visiting the holy Muslim cities of Mecca and Medina. He was initially not allowed to enter the city of Baghdad, which made him spend the night in the cemetery outside the city. The shrine was originally constructed by the local people in the cemetery area in Guru Nanak's holy memory.
The radiance on Guru Nanak's face was reported to be so profound that word spread that a saint had arrived. Consequently, Guru Nanak exchanged spiritual and metaphysical ideas with religious authorities, especially Pir Dastgir and Pir Bahlol. This led to formation of a group of his followers in Baghdad who remembered the Guru as Baba Nanak.
Dr. Kirpal Singh, a captain in the Indian Medical Service of the British Indian army during World War I, located this gurudwara in the west of Baghdad town between an old graveyard to the north and the present Baghdad Samara railway line to the south. To the Arabs, this place is well known as the Tomb of Bahlol. Further, the book titled "Taajudin’s Diary" with foreword by Dr. Harbans Lal, which is an account of a Muslim author who accompanied Guru Nanak from Mecca to Baghdad, explains in detail the conversations Baba Nanak had with Pir Dastgir and Pir Bahlol.
A former Engineer-in-Chief of the Indian army, Major General Harkirat Singh -- who was instrumental in the design and construction of the present-day Hemkund gurudwara and the technical and management brain behind it visited Baghdad in 1982, with a mission to encourage the local Sikh community to pitch in to make the Baba Nanak Shrine into a major gurudwara, which task was later undertaken after he passed away in 1983. Major General Harkirat Singh was the nephew of Capt. (Dr.) Kirpal Singh and the son of Sardar Sewaram Singh, a Sessions Judge, who wrote the first biography of Guru Nanak in the English Language. In that book, titled "Divine Master," Sardar Sewaram Singh writes about the Baba Nanak Shrine and the inscription on a stone tablet. In its revised edition, the book gives the layout of the shrine as drawn by Capt. (Dr.) Kirpal Singh.
Adopted from Wikipedea
The founder of the Sikh religion, Guru Nanak, came to Baghdad in the early sixteenth century, around 1511 AD after visiting the holy Muslim cities of Mecca and Medina. He was initially not allowed to enter the city of Baghdad, which made him spend the night in the cemetery outside the city. The shrine was originally constructed by the local people in the cemetery area in Guru Nanak's holy memory.
The radiance on Guru Nanak's face was reported to be so profound that word spread that a saint had arrived. Consequently, Guru Nanak exchanged spiritual and metaphysical ideas with religious authorities, especially Pir Dastgir and Pir Bahlol. This led to formation of a group of his followers in Baghdad who remembered the Guru as Baba Nanak.
Dr. Kirpal Singh, a captain in the Indian Medical Service of the British Indian army during World War I, located this gurudwara in the west of Baghdad town between an old graveyard to the north and the present Baghdad Samara railway line to the south. To the Arabs, this place is well known as the Tomb of Bahlol. Further, the book titled "Taajudin’s Diary" with foreword by Dr. Harbans Lal, which is an account of a Muslim author who accompanied Guru Nanak from Mecca to Baghdad, explains in detail the conversations Baba Nanak had with Pir Dastgir and Pir Bahlol.
A former Engineer-in-Chief of the Indian army, Major General Harkirat Singh -- who was instrumental in the design and construction of the present-day Hemkund gurudwara and the technical and management brain behind it visited Baghdad in 1982, with a mission to encourage the local Sikh community to pitch in to make the Baba Nanak Shrine into a major gurudwara, which task was later undertaken after he passed away in 1983. Major General Harkirat Singh was the nephew of Capt. (Dr.) Kirpal Singh and the son of Sardar Sewaram Singh, a Sessions Judge, who wrote the first biography of Guru Nanak in the English Language. In that book, titled "Divine Master," Sardar Sewaram Singh writes about the Baba Nanak Shrine and the inscription on a stone tablet. In its revised edition, the book gives the layout of the shrine as drawn by Capt. (Dr.) Kirpal Singh.
Adopted from Wikipedea
It is in continuation of your post for information. After performing Hajj Guru Nanak visited Baghdad, there he met sufi Bahlol. As in your post there is mention of Bahlol that's why I continued it.kmaherali wrote:Interesting information. How is it related to the title of this thread - Facing Kaaba?