Introduction to Ismailism

al-azhar · Post by **al-azhar** » Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:49 pm

An interesting website on Ismailism by BY DR. SHEIKH KHODR HAMAWI.
The "about the author" introduction is written by Abualy. A. Aziz, Missionary.
http://members.tripod.com/outside link deleted by admin

----------------------------------
The link is a copy from http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0583.html

admin

Post by **Admin** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 2:15 pm

al-azhar wrote:An interesting website on Ismailism by BY DR. SHEIKH KHODR HAMAWI.
The "about the author" introduction is written by Abualy. A. Aziz, Missionary.
http://members.tripod.com/ deleted by admin

The link is a copy from http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0583.html

admin

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed May 18, 2005 4:38 am

Assallamun alaikum,
I am a scholar of Shia Ithna-asheris(Twelver Shiites)and i want to chat with my brethrens the Agakhanist Shiites. Can i?

YA ALI MADAD!
Hussein .M. Parmar,
[email protected],
+255 741 608 743

logical · Post by **logical** » Wed May 18, 2005 2:50 pm

Anonymous wrote:
Assallamun alaikum,
I am a scholar of Shia Ithna-asheris(Twelver Shiites)and i want to chat with my brethrens the Agakhanist Shiites. Can i?

YA ALI MADAD!
Hussein .M. Parmar,
[email protected],
+255 741 608 743

Ya Ali madad,

Sure brother!

I'll try.

tasbiha · Post by **tasbiha** » Wed May 18, 2005 8:47 pm

[quote="Anonymous"]8)
[color=red]Assallamun alaikum,
I am a scholar of Shia Ithna-asheris(Twelver Shiites)and i want to chat with my brethrens the Agakhanist Shiites. Can i?

YA ALI MADAD![/color]
Hussein .M. Parmar,
[email protected],
+255 741 608 743
:)[/quote]

Yeah, riiiight. If you're a Shi'ite you'd say YAA ALI MADAD a the beginning.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu May 19, 2005 3:53 am

YA ALI,
Why do you people call the first Imam Ali(K.W) as The True God(Sahi-Allah) and i heared that you say Allah(S.W.T) wanted to enjoy and manifest himself at the world so he put himself in the womb of Fatima bint Asad(mother of the Imam Ali)
[email protected]

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu May 19, 2005 4:02 am

Listen brothers i am neither a scholar nor a teacher.
I was a Sunni Muslim and after studying Shiaism, i converted to Shia Ithna-asheri when i was 15 years but still i believe that i am at the wrong path. I want to know much about other Shiites. When i ask Ithna-asheris about any religion(e.g,Sunni Islam,Christianity,Judaism,Sufism,Bahaism,e.t.c),they will tell you but if you ask them about Agakhanist Shiites, they simply tell you,"The extremists who worship the Imams."

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu May 19, 2005 4:14 am

[/b]My parents died when i was 20 days. I was toutured so much by my maternal uncle when i left my ancestoral Sunni faith.Now i am sleeping at the mosque and eating at the house of a Shiite sage at our country Syed.Murtaza Kamanpoori who is a poorman too and his job is healing people using the Holy Koran and Duas of the Imams of the Ehle-Beit. I have testified that the only living deascendent of Prophet(SAAW) is Karim H.H.Agakhan IV

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu May 19, 2005 4:16 am

[quote="Anonymous"][/b]My parents died when i was 20 days. I was toutured so much by my maternal uncle when i left my ancestoral Sunni faith.Now i am sleeping at the mosque and eating at the house of a Shiite sage at our country Syed.Murtaza Kamanpoori who is a poorman too and his job is healing people using the Holy Koran and Duas of the Imams of the Ehle-Beit. I have testified that the only living deascendent of Prophet(SAAW) is Karim H.H.Agakhan IV
[email protected]
+255 741 608 743

logical · Post by **logical** » Thu May 19, 2005 2:29 pm

Anonymous wrote:YA ALI,
Why do you people call the first Imam Ali(K.W) as The True God(Sahi-Allah) and i heared that you say Allah(S.W.T) wanted to enjoy and manifest himself at the world so he put himself in the womb of Fatima bint Asad(mother of the Imam Ali)
[email protected]

Ya Ali Madad brother hussein,

Let's split your above quote into two parts:

Q1. Why do you people call the first Imam Ali(K.W) as The True God(Sahi-Allah)

Answer:
Actualy, it is not just "us people' , rather all who believe call the Creator by Ali and His many NAMES;
or:
Allah is truly(sahih) Ali who is known by " many NAMES"; Ninety Nine Names 99 for example but not necessarily restricted to 99.

"The most beautiful names belong to Allah. So call on him by them" [7:180]

MORE important when there was nothing - no Heavens or Earth, there existed Ali - the primordial Name of the Divine which is Nothing but Noor/Light, also expressed as:
Whatever is, is YA Ali!

Ali is central in Ismaili cosmology which traces Imams (always present)- bearers of this Noor of Ali (primordial Name of Allah) to the present Imam of the Time: "Noor ala Noor! Light upon Light" [HQ 24:35]

Q2. You say; " and i heared that you say Allah(S.W.T) wanted to enjoy and manifest himself at the world so he put himself in the womb of Fatima bint Asad(mother of the Imam Ali)"

Answer:
It never ceases to amaze me what other muslims will say about Ismailis:

Allah who is Noor is never absent from this world. And, that is the meaning (imo) of this particular 12'er hadith:

Imam Muhammad al-Baqir (A.S.) that he stated, "If Imam (A.S.) is absent from the world even for a moment, the earth would suck in all its inhabitants like the stormy sea drowns the seafarers. " (Ghaibat-e-Nomani, p. 139, Chap. 8, Hadith No. 10)

The Holy Quran 24:35 says : "Allah is the Ligh//Noor of the Heavens & the Earth..". Prophet Muhamad & Hazrat Ali are from the same Divine Light/Noor, same Truth & Knowledge. With 'Ali this Noor became MANIFEST, not by a physical birth as you have quoted but by Nass (designation) from 'Muhammad to'Ali.

The imams - their physical features changes , but the light is One (TAWHEED), the light of ALI, also known by many NAMES

If you say that Ismailis worship their Imam is akin to saying that Shias worship their dead Imams and their shrines in Iraq or Sunnis believe that Allah has a FORM of "sixty cubit"; that sits upon a "created throne in the created 7th heaven". The Truth is -> all including Ismailis worship His essence which is Noor expressed by many NAMES.

"He is the First and the Last, the Evident (Zahir) and the Immanent (Batin) and He has full knowledge of all things"[57:3]

Pls relate the above explanation with the following 12'er shia belief in Imam & eternal Imamate:

IMAM.MAHDI A.S CAUSE OF SURVIVAL OF THE UNIVERSE
Imam Muhammad al-Baqir (A.S.) that he stated, "If Imam (A.S.) is absent from the world even for a moment, the earth would suck in all its inhabitants like the stormy sea drowns the seafarers. " (Ghaibat-e-Nomani, p. 139, Chap. 8, Hadith No. 10)

IMAM (A.S.) : THE SOUL OF UNIVERSE
The existence of Imam (A.S.) in this vast world is having the same position as the soul and the heart. As the body's movement is a proof of the presence of heart and the soul. In the same way, the living world is a proof of the existence of the soul of the universe, Hazrat Vali e Asr (may our lives be sacrificed for him).

IMAM IS THE GOAL OF THE ENTIRE CREATION
, "0 Ali, if we had not been there: Allah would have created neither Adam nor Hawwa, neither heaven nor hell, neither sky nor the earth. " (Kamaluddin, Chap. 33, Hadith No. 4, p. 254, Vol. 1)

We (Able Bait) have been created for the Almighty and the creatures have been created for us. "
(Nahjul Balagha, Letter No. 28)

IMAM (A.S.) IS THE CAUSE OF THE CONTINUED EXISTENCE OF THE WORLD
an Imam is the divine light upon the earth, the absolute proof of Allah upon His creatures, the life-vein of the universe, the spiritual connection between the Creator and the creatures, the mirror of perfection,

The following lines of Ziarat-e-Jamea make it amply clear that if there is no Imam, the sky will crash to the earth and not even a single drop of rain will reach the earth. May my parents, life, family and wealth be sacrificed for you, 0 Imam.

One who intends to reach Allah, begins with you. One who believed in the Oneness of Allah has received the monotheistic teachings from you. One who wishes to be steadfast on it, should seek guidance from you.

0 Master, your praises and extolations canned be enumerated. The reality of your praise cannot be perceived. Your qualities cannot be estimated. You are the light of the righteous, the guide of those who do good and the proof of Allah, the All Powerful.

Allah has initiated the creation (of this universe) with you. And its end will also be with you. The heavens pour because of you. The skies hold for your sake alone. Of course, by His permission. For you alone, Allah removes the sorrows and solves the difficulties of the people. Through you, the universe receives the bounties of Allah.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat May 21, 2005 7:31 am

YA ALI MADAD!
What is your belief concerning Imam Hassan.Why is he not counted as the Imam among you?The twelver Shiites say that Hassan(a.s) was he inheritor Of Imam Ali(K.W) and was the second Imam from the progeny of the Prophet Muhamad(s.a.a.w).Help me in this.
Wassallam

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Sat May 21, 2005 11:31 am

Anonymous wrote:YA ALI MADAD!
What is your belief concerning Imam Hassan.Why is he not counted as the Imam among you?The twelver Shiites say that Hassan(a.s) was he inheritor Of Imam Ali(K.W) and was the second Imam from the progeny of the Prophet Muhamad(s.a.a.w).Help me in this.
Wassallam

According to our tradition, inheritance of Imamat through 'nass' does not pass from brother to a brother. It can only occur from father to son or grandfather to grandson.

We believe that Hazarat Ali appointed Imam Husein as Imam. Hazarat Hasan inherited the Khilafat from Hazarat Ali. Inheritance of khilafat does not imply inheritance of Imamat. They are independent offices.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon May 23, 2005 4:03 am

kmaherali wrote:
Anonymous wrote:YA ALI MADAD! What is your belief concerning Imam Hassan.Why is he not counted as the Imam among you?The twelver Shiites say that Hassan(a.s) was he inheritor Of Imam Ali(K.W) and was the second Imam from the progeny of the Prophet Muhamad(s.a.a.w).Help me in this. Wassallam
 According to our tradition, inheritance of Imamat through 'nass' does not pass from brother to a brother. It can only occur from father to son or grandfather to grandson. We believe that Hazarat Ali appointed Imam Husein as Imam. Hazarat Hasan inherited the Khilafat from Hazarat Ali. Inheritance of khilafat does not imply inheritance of Imamat. They are independent offices.

Mowla Ali Madad! Who was the inheritor of Imam Jaffer Sadique? because some Ismailies tell me it was Muhamad bin Ismail but others refute the abouve claim. secondly what is the status of Imam Musa Kadhim(a.s)(The Ithna-asheri 7th Imam) in your Tariqah? Wassallam and thanks for thy favours and may Panjataan-e-paak's noor be with us all for they are infallibles and we are but criminals.

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Mon May 23, 2005 9:57 am

Anonymous wrote:Mowla Ali Madad!Who was the inheritor of Imam Jaffer Sadique? because some Ismailies tell me it was Muhamad bin Ismail but others refute the abouve claim.secondly what is the status of Imam Musa Kadhim(a.s)(The Ithna-asheri 7th Imam) in your Tariqah?Wassallam and thanks for thy favours and may Panjataan-e-paak's noor be with us all for they are infallibles and we are but criminals.

Ya Ali Madad!

The inheritor of Imam Jaffer Sadique was Imam Ismail. When Imam Jaffer as Sadiq passed away, Imam Ismail was in Syria on a religious mission. The secrecy of his whereabouts and the apparent lack of communication tempted Musa Kasim to assume Imamat. In our tradition Musa Kazim is just the son of Imam and nothing more.

There are two notions of Imamat in our tradition.

Imam Mustaqarr - Actual Imam
Imam Mustawda - Entrusted Imam in the absence of the actual Imam.

Upon the death of Imam Jaffer as Saddiq, Muhamad bin Ismail was appointed Imam Mustawda and Imam Ismail was appointed Imam Mustaqarr.

Upon the death of Imam Ismail, Muhamad bin Ismail became Imam Mustaqarr.

I hope that clarifies matters.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed May 25, 2005 5:28 am

YA ALI MADAD!
Why are Ismailies not praying Namaaz? and if they are praying Namaaz, they don't perform Wudhoo(physical ablution)?
Mowla Ali

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Wed May 25, 2005 8:32 am

Anonymous wrote:YA ALI MADAD!
Why are Ismailies not praying Namaaz? and if they are praying Namaaz, they don't perform Wudhoo(physical ablution)?
Mowla Ali

YA ALI MADAD
Ismailis say Dua which contains six ayats of the Quran. Namaz has not been prescribed in the Quran. We follow what has been prescribed by HazarImam who interpretes the faith according to changing times.

We pay more attention to inner cleansing as opposed to external cleansing. Nevertheless, we do ensure that we are reasonably clean externally before we go for communal prayers.

There has been extensive discussion on this issue in this forum under:

Customs and Traditions -> Praying 3X as opposed to 5X

You may want to go there.

Post by **Admin** » Wed May 25, 2005 12:24 pm

No theological discussions in this thred please. The title says "Book", this is meant for book discussions, book reviews, new book announcement etc...

Admin

Introduction to Ismailism

Introduction to Ismailism

Re: Introduction to Ismailism