Ya Ali Madad,
The following two articles authored by late Alwaez Shamshudin Haji are related to the concept of "DAS AVTAAR". The first one is a lecture given by Mr. Jafferali Laji after he was converted from Hinduism. The second one relates to Mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah's recollection of His manifestation as Lord Krishna at Mathura. The purpose behind posting the two articles is two fold:
- First, to illustrate the reinforcing aspect of a miracle to reason in the progression of faith. Mr. Lalji's group were first introduced to the SATPANTH religion by Ismaili missionaries who used reasoning based on scriptures. The group was convinced of the truth and needed further evidence before they could comit themselves to the SATPANTH religion.
- Secondly, to demontrate that the concept of "DAS AVTAAR" is not a product of Hindu mythology used as a conversion ploy by our Peers, but a reality as verified by the Imam in the most dramatic manner. More about DAS AVTAAR is given in "Anant Akhado (Ashaji)" verse 404 onwards. Here they are... I hope you enjoy them..
A HOLY DIDAR OF “DAS AVTAARS”
“IT WAS DUE TO THE GRACE OF IMAM SULTAN MUHAMMAD SHAH (A.S.) THAT HE BESTOWED HIS UNIQUE HOLY DIDAR - - A DARSHAN OF ‘DAS AVTARS’ TO ME AND IT LED TO EMBRACE ISMAILI SATPANTH”
A LECTURE DELIVERED BY MR. JAFFERALI LALJI AT THE GOLDEN JUBILEE HALL, DAR-ES-SALAAM, IN SEPTEMBER 1941. THE AUTHOR WAS PRESENT.
Dear Brothers and Sisters,
A few years ago, I was a Hindu by cast, resident of Gujerat. Ismaili missionaries from the Recreation Club of Bombay were visiting our Province on mission of propagating Ismaili Faith. They used to arrange ‘BHAJAN PARTIES’ and ‘SATSANG’ gatherings where I was invited several times.
Your missionaries were, no doubt, well versed in VED, GITA, and PURAN Shashtras and through these scriptures, they endeavoured to prove Ismaili Dharma (Religion) as THE TRUE “SATPANTH” DHARMA where in “NOOR-E-ALI” had descended and IMAM SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH is the FORTY_EIGHTH BEARER of THE “NOOR-E-IMAMAT,” DASMA NAKLANKI AVTAR.
After a number of SATSANG MULAKATS most of the members of our group, numbering two hundred, were convinced of what the missionaries had said about the DIVINE ASPECT of MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH, who was the FORTY_EIGHTH JOMADHARI NOOR MOWLA MURTAZA ALI (SHRI VISHNU VAR DATAR). We, the participants of the ISMAILI BHAJAN MANDALI, were well convinced and agreed to embrace ISMAILI FAITH, but in one way wished it was practically proved – the DIVINE POWER and the PROOF of the “DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR” by MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH HIMSELF. Our group submitted the above suggestion because it would be extremely hard for us to discard our faith and desert our relatives, friends and fellow brothers unless we had been convinced to the fullest as to the genuineness of the DIVINE “LIGHT” OF SHRI VISHNU.
After some years following this, good news of Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah’s MUBARAK PADHRAMNI was announced and our aspirant group was invited to visit Bombay for HOLY DIDAR. We all readily agreed to go to Bombay.
During the misssionaries’ MEHMANI, a request was submitted to KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM explaining how a group of Hindus has been given instruction on the present LIVING DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR and a result of various meetings everything was done pending final “PROOF” of KHUDAVIND’S KHUDAI NOOR NAKLANK AVTAR.
Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah was much delighted to read the missionaries’ ARIJA and most graciously made HOLY FARMAN for the arrangement of a meeting with our Hindu group, of approximately two hundred in number – young and old, ladies, gents, and children.
The next day was a RED LETTER DAY! for us. We made ourselves present at the Recreation Club Office in the morning and KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM arrived at about 11:00 a.m.
At first glance we were very much touched to behold KHUDAVIND’S HOLY DIDAR. MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH, on HIS arrival, said:
“ACCHA TUMKO NAKLANK KA DARSHAN KARNA HAY? SHABASH.”
MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH was seated on the sofa. HIS ‘NOORANI’ complexion was so charming that our hearts and souls, totally and instantly, became devoted and dedicated to HIM.
And LO! In moments there were the amazing appearances of the HOLY DAS AVTARS.
We beheld DIDAR of SHRI MACHHA AVTAR, then KORBHA, VARAH, NARSINHA, VAMAN, FARSIRAM, RAMCHADRAJI, SHRI KRISHNA, SHRI BUDHA, and lastly DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH in HIS DIVINE ASPECT.
We all bowed down immediately in front of the “NOOR-E-PANJTAN PAK” SHRI VISHNU, ALI VAR AVTAR. (ALLAHUMA SALI ALLAH MOHAMMADAN WA AALE MOHAMMED.) Tears of unsurpassable happiness and joy were shed from our eyes. It was truly an unforgettable event of our lives, which cannot be expressed in its perspective.
However, all the members of our group prayed to KHUDAVIND to accept us all as HIS Spiritual Children.
HAZER IMAM SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH blessed us and said: “KHANAVADAN”.
HIS “NOORANI” ARSHIDWADS enlightened our souls to such a high extent that we, to this day, cannot express it by words. It was a day greatest of all days, the day we embraced THE ISMAILI SATPANTH DHARMA where THE “NOORANI” LIVING JYOT is EVER-PRESENT.
We realize that we have SAVED our BILLIONS of BIRTHS and RE-BIRTHS by the HOLY NOORANI DARSHAN and DIDAR. It is because we recognized the “NOOR” of ALI. SHRI VISHNU, we recognized the “NOORANI” JYOT. We had been always reading in our SHASHTRAS (Scriptures) of the advent of SHRI KRISHNA, but we were not knowledgeable of the LIVING KRISHNA, we were not knowledgeable of NAKLANKI AVTAR. We were most fortunate to be graced with the DARSHAN and DIDAR of SHRI NAKLANK – MOWLANA SULTAN MUHAMMAD SHAH, in our lives.
Finally, Mr. Jafferally Laji recited a verse of Holy Ginan.
EJI JO JEEV JAAVE SHAAHKA NAAM NA CHHODU,
DHAR SEER KARVAT ANGA NA MODU….
Explanation:- If someone were to cut my throat even, I would not leave the HOLY HOUSE OF HAZARIMAM: HIS HOLY NAME will be on my lips till the last breath of my life. AMEN.
Truly wonderful, amazing and unique, the story of Huzur Mukhi Jafferali Lalji’s family and colleagues.
**To give a brief introduction of the lecturer: Mr. Jafferali Laji and Count Mohammed Alarakhia were related through the marriage of their son and daughter respectively, which took place after the above incident.
“MISSIONARY! YE KONSA STATION HAY?” Mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah while recollecting His Divine “Noorani” aspect and “Noorani” incarnation of five thousand years ago, asked one of the missionaries on His Huzur staff while travelling in the interior of India.
“KHUDAWIND! YE MATHURA KA STATION HE! ,” the missionary replied.
“MISSIONARY, KRISHNA AVTAR ME MAYNE IDHAR BAHOT KHEL KIYA, AUR MOMINOKO BAHOT LADD LADAYA,” Mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah uttered these unique and most wonderful recollections of His Divine Avtar.
The DARSHAN OF DAS AVTAAR
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Guest
Firman on DAS AVTAAR
While I am at it, I thought of the following Firman of Mowlana Sultan Muhammad Shah which is of relevance to the subject.
"The philosophy of Ten Incarnations (DAS AVTAAR) should be taken and explained in the light of Islamic principles; also the understanding of ALLAH'S NOOR, whose lineal descent is from even before creation, should be given. These principles, Pir Sadardin during the time of Shri Islam Shah has explained, they should be explained in a similar manner.
(Kalam-e Imam-e Mubin, II, p473).
"The philosophy of Ten Incarnations (DAS AVTAAR) should be taken and explained in the light of Islamic principles; also the understanding of ALLAH'S NOOR, whose lineal descent is from even before creation, should be given. These principles, Pir Sadardin during the time of Shri Islam Shah has explained, they should be explained in a similar manner.
(Kalam-e Imam-e Mubin, II, p473).
A useful insight and explanation of the significance of the 'Avtaars' meaning 'incarnations' - manifestations of God's special expressive (Sifati) aspects, in the context of the world's religious history from a Hindu perspective. According to Ismaili version, the Kalki avataar is the Dasmo Naklanki Avtaar - present cycle of Imamat beginning with Hazarat Ali.
SanathanaDharma.com
Gita Govinda Mahakavya of 13th Century Poet Jayadeva
Introduction
Sri Jayadeva was the court poet of King Lakshmanasena who ruled in Bengal in the twelfth century. His mastery of the Sanskrit language was matched by his proficiency in both music and dancing. He was a mystic and a devotee of Sri Krishna.
Jayadeva's only known work, Gita Govindam, embodies the great wealth of his devotion and mystical experience. It is a great poetical masterpiece in twelve cantos of mellifluous verses and songs in Sanskrit, set to music and adapted to representation through dance. The theme of it is the love of Radha and Krishna, symbolizing the longing and striving of the individual, for communion with God, culminating in their blissful union. The language and the imagery expresses the most intense form of love in all its moods and phases.
The First Astapadi
The first section sings of the ten incarnations of Lord Vishnu. The text, transliteration, and translation of it are given here.The Dasavatara Stotra is a hymn to Lord Vishnu. It is the first section in the Gita-Govindam of Sri Jayadeva.
Incarnation is a special manifestation of God for a specific purpose. The scriptures tell us that the incarnations are innumerable. Some of these are described in detail and the others are left to the imagination of the devotee. The general principle is that wherever some thing grand, beautiful, or glorious is seen, it is to be understood as embodying a part of God's glory.
In the Bhagavata, twenty-four incarnations are enumerated and described. These include Kapila, the great rishi a founder of the Sankhya school of philosophy, and Rishabha whom the Jains revere as their first prophet. By extending the analogy, all the great sages, whose lives and teachings have reinforced spirituality should be considered as incarnations, descents, or embodiments of God's glory. All incarnations have a common purpose, the protection of the good, the destruction of evil and the establishment of dharma.
Jayadeva enumerates ten of them. They are : (1) Matsya, the Fish; (2) Kurma, the Tortoise; (3) Varaha, the Boar; (4) Narasimha, the Man-lion; (5) Vamana, the Dwarf; (6) Parasurama; (7) Rama; (8) Balarama; (9) Buddhu; and (10) Kalki.
In the Fish incarnation the primary purpose was the recovery of the Vedas, which has been stolen by a demon and hidden in the waters. This required the destruction of the demon. This symbolizes the restoration of true knowledge, subverted by egoism, which has to be destroyed in the process.
The second incarnation is the Tortoise. The gods and demons undertook the Churning of the milk-ocean with the mount Meru as the churn to obtain the nectar of immortality. They found the churn sinking into the ocean and were unable to hold it up. Then God appeared as the great Tortoise on whose back the mountain could rest and allow the process of churning to proceed, bringing up different products, and ultimately, the nectar of immortality.
When we proceed to churn the ocean of experience with the churn of knowledge, in search of reality, we find that knowledge itself requires a base to prove its validity. The attempt to find an ultimate base on which to erect our structure of reasoning can end in an infinite regress, unless it reset on the immovable, all-sufficient, all-sustaining basis of self-evident truth symbolized by the Tortoise form of God.
The third is the Boar. God incarnated this time to lift up the earth which had been taken away into the regions of darkness, under the waters, by Hiranyaksha, a demon. The demon was destroyed and the earth was retrieved. In the both Vishnupurana and the Bhagawatha, the Boar form of God is identified with sacrifice. And Sacrifice, in its turn is not different from God himself. This can be understood as illustrating that stability or order, as contrasted with instability or chaos, can be achieved only through sacrifice, which is again based on the absolute.
In the next, the Man-lion incarnation, the emphasis is on devotion. This guarded the child devotee Prahlada. He was put to endless tortures by this father, Haranyakasipu, a demon, for repeating God's name instead of his own. But Prahlada withstood all the tortures with steadfast devotion. Finally God appeared as Man-lion, of terrible form and killed the demon. This Man-lion incarnation indicates that God is incomprehensible, i.e. He is not limited by our knowledge. It also illustrates that the real devotee alone is truly fearless and even the terrible form has no terror for him.
The dwarf incarnation shows us that valor finds fulfillment only in complete surrender to God. King Bali, the mighty, vanquished all gods, including Indra, the lord of heaven. But he found his true fulfillment when he surrendered himself completely to God. When the might of the ego is thus crushed under the holy foot of God, it is not annihilated but transformed to everlasting blissful existence in the awareness if His presence and protection and ultimate union with Him.
Note the gradual change of form. The Divine appears first as aquatic fish, then as the amphibian tortoise, the land animal boar, and the half-animal-half-human Man-lion. Finally emerges the pygmy, Vamana. This transition for a wonder, anticipates the modern theory of evolution of species.
Next is Parasurama. When the power conferred for protection, grown mighty by its proper exercise, had however degenerated into an oppressive tyranny, it had to be crushed ruthlessly. The terrible Parasurama was the appropriate form for this need.
Then came Sri Rama, perfect in his general dharma as man and in his particular dharma as king. This is a demonstration of how man can rise to divinity, by unswerving adherence to the law of his being, his dharma, in all its details.
In this text, the eighth incarnation is Balarama, the elder brother of Sri Krishna. To Jayadeva and the Vaishnavas, Sri Krishna is not an incarnation, He is God Himself, here addressed as Hari and Kesava, the Entity who appeared in the ten forms.
Buddha the ninth incarnation is the embodiment of compassion. When a section of people was steeped in ignorance and the scripture had become inaccessible to them, when most of those who had access to such knowledge were concerned more with the form than with the spirit of their teaching, there was, then an all-round spiritual poverty. The consequent misery of the people stirred God's compassion and He appeared as Buddha to show men the way out of misery.
The last incarnation of the ten is yet to be as Kalki, the mighty warrior, born in a pious family, to rid the world of the oppression of its unrighteous rulers.
Thus, while the general purpose of protecting the good, destroying evil and establishing the law is common to all the incarnations, it is possible to see an emphasis on a particular aspect in each incarnation.
Can we say, then, that each incarnation was a manifestation suitable for a particular time and the conditions then prevailing? This would be only partially true, for the conditions that evoked the different manifestations never totally ceased to be. It would be more correct to understand them as embodiments of an eternal message; an eternal response of God in His unlimited compassion, to the eternal need of His creatures, in the infinite variety if their moods, temperaments and abilities, for guidance in their struggle for communion with Him.
Jayadeva's DASAVATARA STROTRA
O God, in the form of a Fish! In the flood of dissolution you have held up the revealed knowledge of the Vedas, like a boat, without effort. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Boar! The world rests in peace on the tip of your tusk, like the dark marking on the disc of the moon. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of Man-lion! In your hand of lotus-like beauty, are the finger nails with their wonderful tips which have torn asunder the most powerful demon Hiranyakasipu, as if he was a huge insect. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Dwarf! By planting your feet you have cheated Bali, the mighty. Ganga, the river which sanctifies the world, has come out of your toe-nails. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Lord of the Bhrigus, you have bathed the world in the blood of the tyrannous rulers, thus cleansing it of sin and destroying the misery of its relative existence. Hail! Hari, God of the universe, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the body of Sri Rama! You have made a beautiful offering of the ten heads of the demon Ravana in battle to the guardians of the cardinal directions. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Balarama, the bearer of the plough! You wear on your immaculate body a garment of the colour of the cloud, blue like the Yamuna, darkened by the fear of being dragged by your plough. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the body of Buddha, the enlightened! Out of Compassion o your heart you have condemned the ritualistic portion of the Vedas ordaining the killing of animals. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Kalki! For the destruction of the wicked, you carry a meteor-like sword in your hand, trailing a train of disaster to them. Hail! Hari, God of the World, Victory to Thee!
O God, who took ten forms! Please listen to this song of jayadeva. It bestows goodness, and joy; it is the essence of life. Hail! Hari, God of the world, victory to Thee!
http://www.sanathanadharma.com/jayadeva/stotra.htm
SanathanaDharma.com
Gita Govinda Mahakavya of 13th Century Poet Jayadeva
Introduction
Sri Jayadeva was the court poet of King Lakshmanasena who ruled in Bengal in the twelfth century. His mastery of the Sanskrit language was matched by his proficiency in both music and dancing. He was a mystic and a devotee of Sri Krishna.
Jayadeva's only known work, Gita Govindam, embodies the great wealth of his devotion and mystical experience. It is a great poetical masterpiece in twelve cantos of mellifluous verses and songs in Sanskrit, set to music and adapted to representation through dance. The theme of it is the love of Radha and Krishna, symbolizing the longing and striving of the individual, for communion with God, culminating in their blissful union. The language and the imagery expresses the most intense form of love in all its moods and phases.
The First Astapadi
The first section sings of the ten incarnations of Lord Vishnu. The text, transliteration, and translation of it are given here.The Dasavatara Stotra is a hymn to Lord Vishnu. It is the first section in the Gita-Govindam of Sri Jayadeva.
Incarnation is a special manifestation of God for a specific purpose. The scriptures tell us that the incarnations are innumerable. Some of these are described in detail and the others are left to the imagination of the devotee. The general principle is that wherever some thing grand, beautiful, or glorious is seen, it is to be understood as embodying a part of God's glory.
In the Bhagavata, twenty-four incarnations are enumerated and described. These include Kapila, the great rishi a founder of the Sankhya school of philosophy, and Rishabha whom the Jains revere as their first prophet. By extending the analogy, all the great sages, whose lives and teachings have reinforced spirituality should be considered as incarnations, descents, or embodiments of God's glory. All incarnations have a common purpose, the protection of the good, the destruction of evil and the establishment of dharma.
Jayadeva enumerates ten of them. They are : (1) Matsya, the Fish; (2) Kurma, the Tortoise; (3) Varaha, the Boar; (4) Narasimha, the Man-lion; (5) Vamana, the Dwarf; (6) Parasurama; (7) Rama; (8) Balarama; (9) Buddhu; and (10) Kalki.
In the Fish incarnation the primary purpose was the recovery of the Vedas, which has been stolen by a demon and hidden in the waters. This required the destruction of the demon. This symbolizes the restoration of true knowledge, subverted by egoism, which has to be destroyed in the process.
The second incarnation is the Tortoise. The gods and demons undertook the Churning of the milk-ocean with the mount Meru as the churn to obtain the nectar of immortality. They found the churn sinking into the ocean and were unable to hold it up. Then God appeared as the great Tortoise on whose back the mountain could rest and allow the process of churning to proceed, bringing up different products, and ultimately, the nectar of immortality.
When we proceed to churn the ocean of experience with the churn of knowledge, in search of reality, we find that knowledge itself requires a base to prove its validity. The attempt to find an ultimate base on which to erect our structure of reasoning can end in an infinite regress, unless it reset on the immovable, all-sufficient, all-sustaining basis of self-evident truth symbolized by the Tortoise form of God.
The third is the Boar. God incarnated this time to lift up the earth which had been taken away into the regions of darkness, under the waters, by Hiranyaksha, a demon. The demon was destroyed and the earth was retrieved. In the both Vishnupurana and the Bhagawatha, the Boar form of God is identified with sacrifice. And Sacrifice, in its turn is not different from God himself. This can be understood as illustrating that stability or order, as contrasted with instability or chaos, can be achieved only through sacrifice, which is again based on the absolute.
In the next, the Man-lion incarnation, the emphasis is on devotion. This guarded the child devotee Prahlada. He was put to endless tortures by this father, Haranyakasipu, a demon, for repeating God's name instead of his own. But Prahlada withstood all the tortures with steadfast devotion. Finally God appeared as Man-lion, of terrible form and killed the demon. This Man-lion incarnation indicates that God is incomprehensible, i.e. He is not limited by our knowledge. It also illustrates that the real devotee alone is truly fearless and even the terrible form has no terror for him.
The dwarf incarnation shows us that valor finds fulfillment only in complete surrender to God. King Bali, the mighty, vanquished all gods, including Indra, the lord of heaven. But he found his true fulfillment when he surrendered himself completely to God. When the might of the ego is thus crushed under the holy foot of God, it is not annihilated but transformed to everlasting blissful existence in the awareness if His presence and protection and ultimate union with Him.
Note the gradual change of form. The Divine appears first as aquatic fish, then as the amphibian tortoise, the land animal boar, and the half-animal-half-human Man-lion. Finally emerges the pygmy, Vamana. This transition for a wonder, anticipates the modern theory of evolution of species.
Next is Parasurama. When the power conferred for protection, grown mighty by its proper exercise, had however degenerated into an oppressive tyranny, it had to be crushed ruthlessly. The terrible Parasurama was the appropriate form for this need.
Then came Sri Rama, perfect in his general dharma as man and in his particular dharma as king. This is a demonstration of how man can rise to divinity, by unswerving adherence to the law of his being, his dharma, in all its details.
In this text, the eighth incarnation is Balarama, the elder brother of Sri Krishna. To Jayadeva and the Vaishnavas, Sri Krishna is not an incarnation, He is God Himself, here addressed as Hari and Kesava, the Entity who appeared in the ten forms.
Buddha the ninth incarnation is the embodiment of compassion. When a section of people was steeped in ignorance and the scripture had become inaccessible to them, when most of those who had access to such knowledge were concerned more with the form than with the spirit of their teaching, there was, then an all-round spiritual poverty. The consequent misery of the people stirred God's compassion and He appeared as Buddha to show men the way out of misery.
The last incarnation of the ten is yet to be as Kalki, the mighty warrior, born in a pious family, to rid the world of the oppression of its unrighteous rulers.
Thus, while the general purpose of protecting the good, destroying evil and establishing the law is common to all the incarnations, it is possible to see an emphasis on a particular aspect in each incarnation.
Can we say, then, that each incarnation was a manifestation suitable for a particular time and the conditions then prevailing? This would be only partially true, for the conditions that evoked the different manifestations never totally ceased to be. It would be more correct to understand them as embodiments of an eternal message; an eternal response of God in His unlimited compassion, to the eternal need of His creatures, in the infinite variety if their moods, temperaments and abilities, for guidance in their struggle for communion with Him.
Jayadeva's DASAVATARA STROTRA
O God, in the form of a Fish! In the flood of dissolution you have held up the revealed knowledge of the Vedas, like a boat, without effort. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Boar! The world rests in peace on the tip of your tusk, like the dark marking on the disc of the moon. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of Man-lion! In your hand of lotus-like beauty, are the finger nails with their wonderful tips which have torn asunder the most powerful demon Hiranyakasipu, as if he was a huge insect. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Dwarf! By planting your feet you have cheated Bali, the mighty. Ganga, the river which sanctifies the world, has come out of your toe-nails. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Lord of the Bhrigus, you have bathed the world in the blood of the tyrannous rulers, thus cleansing it of sin and destroying the misery of its relative existence. Hail! Hari, God of the universe, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the body of Sri Rama! You have made a beautiful offering of the ten heads of the demon Ravana in battle to the guardians of the cardinal directions. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Balarama, the bearer of the plough! You wear on your immaculate body a garment of the colour of the cloud, blue like the Yamuna, darkened by the fear of being dragged by your plough. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the body of Buddha, the enlightened! Out of Compassion o your heart you have condemned the ritualistic portion of the Vedas ordaining the killing of animals. Hail! Hari, God of the world, Victory to Thee!
O God, in the form of the Kalki! For the destruction of the wicked, you carry a meteor-like sword in your hand, trailing a train of disaster to them. Hail! Hari, God of the World, Victory to Thee!
O God, who took ten forms! Please listen to this song of jayadeva. It bestows goodness, and joy; it is the essence of life. Hail! Hari, God of the world, victory to Thee!
http://www.sanathanadharma.com/jayadeva/stotra.htm
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arshad1988
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In my opinion, by 'Mazhar', it is meant 'locus of manifestation' and hence there is no conflict between the body and the Noor that manifests in it - just as the our soul is created and given a physical form.arshad1988 wrote:According to their interpretation, Krishna was not a manifestation of the Noor, but the Noor itself. What do we Ismailis say about this? Do we believe Krishna was the Noor in his physical form (if that what they are saying)?
As discussed in many threads, there are two facets of Imamat; the Shah and the Pir. The former is the mazhar of the Essence (the Ultimate Source) and the latter the mazhar of the Noor (the Divine Intellect).
Since everything (including the Noor) is derived from the Essence, it follows that the Shah can be the Pir as well but not vice versa. The present Imam being the mazhar of the Essence is also the Pir.
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arshad1988
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:02 am
- Contact:
Thanks for the reply - but this sort of confuses me - Can you expand on this? Since mazhar represents the body and the soul - Is Hazar Imam (body and soul) the mazhar of Allah or just the soul? I don't know if I'm making sense -- does Hazar Imam have a soul? Is His soul His Noor? And if the body and soul together are the mazhar of Allah - does that mean the body is the mazhar of the Noor? I don't know if that is what you alluded to as the Shah and the Pir. Sorry you might think this topic is being escalated - but you can feel free to email me at [email protected] - anyone with helpful insight.
Ya Ali Madad!
Ya Ali Madad!
Yes in my opinion. In Islam there is no dichotomy between body and the soul - they are one. As MHI has said in his Farman, the soul is created and given a physical form. The body is the form or expression of the soul.arshad1988 wrote:Is His soul His Noor? And if the body and soul together are the mazhar of Allah - does that mean the body is the mazhar of the Noor?
The body of the Imam is different than the bodies of the rest of us (although it appears the same). If we were to function as the Imam, our bodies would collapse in a day!
O Ali, I rely on thee...
"Hey Madhavji bapa, Mawla one or two?"
Asked one illliterate Koli villager to Peerbhai Madhvji.
"Oh my innocent brother , how can there be 2 Mawlas?" replied Madhvji.
"But I saw 2 of them" replied the Koli villager named Chhagan
"Then you were not paying attention .Didn't I teach you in the Ginans that there is only one Lord?That means you did not do the Deedar."
said Madhavji with a little concern .
"Oh , no, I did.I saw the 2 men with bright red Jabhhas and golden headwear looking very impressive and everyone in the Pandol were looking at them and reciting salvat I saw both of them very well!", said Chhagan the Koli villager.
Madhvji burst into laughter as soon as he heard this.
"No Chhagan , those two were the Mukhi Kamadias but the one in between them the very young man in white English style coat and suit with the hat looking so very impressive was the Imam!The Saheb!"
"Oh, my dear! I was doing sazdas to those two men in red Jabhhas and golden turbans
First I bowed down to one and then I said Salvat as you taught me, and then I bowed to the second and said salvat.
Now you are laughing but how am I suppose to know who is Hazar Imam? I am a new Ismaili illiterate and ignorant. I have never seen him before .The blind and ignorant are both same." replied Chhagan.
The above conversation took place in a very rural gujarati language in a remote village of Limdi , India after the Deedar.
In 1939 Imam Sultan Mohammadshah visited a small village called Limdi in Gujerat India.
The Ismaili Dawat was in a very significant phase those days.
Persons like Peerbhai Madhvji used to travel from village to village and raise the awareness about the Tenth Naklanki avtar now manifested in the Imame Zaman since 1st Imam Hazarat Murtaza Ali.
It was not an easy task but some of our Fidai workers were very persistent and devoted to the work of davat and many people from various tribes like Kolis, rabaris, Kanbis, lohanas all very poor farmers and shepherds and grocery Men, cooks etc were getting converted to khojas.
(most of us living now in U.S.A, canada, africa,India and Pakistan owe our origins from there.)
Bhagat Peerbhai Madhvji lived a long life of about 80 years but his entire life was devoted to the work of dawat on the path of Satpanth(Sirate Mustakim)
With the ginanic literature given by Peer Saderdin and Peer Hasan Kabirdin thousands of murids were made aware of the Imamat and the satpanth.
His life was full of marvels and miracles of Imame Zaman.
It was a golden period for Ismailis in Hindustan. ( now India and Pakistan) .
Three Imams (47th,47thand 49th) lived there for the longest period and also availed the Jamats of their Deedars and personal interactions which were
so rare in the previous periods and also the current time.It was truly an unique period!
(So much of history lies undisclosed because of language barriers.Nothing was recorded properly because of poor or no technology and also people were very uneducated hence very poorly preserved for future generations)
Madhvji Bapa was inspired to do the work of davat since early childhood.
Peerbhai Madhvji once while travelling from village to village ,spreading Ismaili faith stayed over in a place called "Kanoter"
There lived a Koli villager named "Chhagan"
He was a simple individual with a clean heart and a pious mind.
Just as the birds of the similar feathers flock togather there was a natural affinity among these 2 gentle men based on their lifestyle and piety.
Madvji Bapa used to join the Bhajan Group that recited the devotional songs for the prayers mainly in praise of "Krishna",lead by Chhagan.
There was a verse in Bhajan which indicated towards the arrival of the Tenth avtar in the Kaliyug to destroy the Kalinga.
Lord Krishna was being worshipped as the eigth manifesttion of God
Madhvji asked Chhagan and others the meaning and implication of that verse.
When none of them knew Madhvji explained the presence of Hazar Imam in all ages and time and based on the Ginan affirmed he was the tenth Naklanki avtar, the Mazhar of God.
He explained that God is ever present in this world since time immemorial in various form. It is we who are not recognising him.
He also explained that after Krisna the ninth avtar is finished long time ago and the Tenth avtar is already here for almost 1400 years but we are still stuck to the worship of stone Idol of the God when there is an opportunity to witness a living God and listen to his current guidance.
He convinced a lot of people of Ismaili faith based on his integrated knowledge of Geeta ,Veda Bhagvat and Peer Saderdin's ginanic philosophy.
"Has any of the scriptures said that the God will be in the form of a stone statue?"
Then why are you still not willing to accept the living God instead of a stone Murti?",Madhvji Bhagat asked
"So where is this tenth manifestation of God?and how can we see him?" asked the curious Chhagan.
Madhavji bapa said:
"Yes ,he is present on this earth and I have also seen him." affirmed Mahvjibapa.
He is in the form of a Muslim leader called Agakhan and dresses like a Western man and hence many are not able to recognise him.
The further discussion was so much full of spiritual and batuni concepts that at the end of it the entire group was full of inspiration and love for the Imam and unique eagernes to meet him.
Their eyes were full of tears and heart full of love they requested Madhvji to take them for the deedar of the LORD.
Deedar or darshan was a familiar word for them because some of their Bhajans talked about it.
Madhvji bapa showed them the photo of Imam Sultan Mohammad Shah.
From then onwards started the devotional ginans and Giriyazari tasbihs for the Deedar.
After few months , there came the news that Imame Zaman will be arriving in Limdi( a small town near Kanoter) for the mela.
Mela was like a 7day conference packed with events of few Deedars and other religious ceremonies like Mehmani, Hastamilap(marriages) ,Isme Azam navajish etc.
People from surrounding villages gathered in thousands.There were lots of celebrations and lots of prayers!
So Madvji Bapa took Chhagan and other few men for the Deedar Mela to Limdi.
Now on the occasion of the first Deedar, Chhagan apparently did not recognise the Imame Zaman!
Although illiterate, Chhagan was an intelligent man.
There was one more Deedar next day.
Chhagan came up with a clever new plan!
"Hey Mahvji Bhagat, this time I am going to sit in the very back of the pandol.
You are saying he is the Lord ,so since I did not recognise him atleast He must recognise me as He is our spiritual father.
A child can make mistake but not the father."
"Also Since I have always imagined my Lord to be in a certain form I would like to see him in the same form as I am used to only then your Agakhan can be my Lord otherwise he is the Lord of you Khojas and I have nothing to do with him." said Chhagan in a decisive manner.
"What form ?" asked Madhavji bapa rather alarmed!
"I won't tell you that."
With this sentence he went to the back of the pandol and sat down and with his head down he started the tasbih of "Peer Shah, Peer Shah"
The pandol was full with thousands of murids.
Finally Imame Zaman Shah Sultan Mohammad Shah arrived.The moment was blessed.
Savats were being recited. There was Happiness in the air.
He kept moving everywhere on the red carpet saying Khanavadan and showering blessings.
Here Chhagan was sitting with his face down eyes closed, with a determination that only if Mawla will be seen to him in the "Krisna Bhagvan" form and will recognise him he will be convinced of the Ismaili faith.
A little further away Madhvji bapa was sitting nervously praying" Mawla, you please fulfill Chhagan's desire otherwise I will lose my credibility"
Mawla was walking slowly towards the Takhat after walking around on all the red carpets.
When he was about 10 to 15 steps away from the stage ,he suddenly made a right turn....he stepped out of the redcarpet and making his way through the people sitting he was moving towards the rear end of the pandol! Everyone especially the leaders became confused.
"Mawla, this side, here is the takhat"they tried stopping Mawla.
But Mawla just kept his direction and reached to Chhagan,who was sitting and reciting his tasbih with face down and eyes closed.
Chhagan Bhagat, look up Said Mawla.
Chhagan was indeed startled, he looked up and Lo... he saw Krishna Bhagwan!
He is wearing Yelllow silk pitamber,a jewel studded mukut with peackok feather on the side, a charismatic smile on the face and lot of light surrounding him.
This form was visible only for Chhagan.(as he described later)
"Chhagan bhagat,Is your doubt now cleared?"
"I am the same one who was in Gokul, taking care of the cows.
this is my tenth avtar, now forget Ram Krishna and say Ya Ali madad"
Chhagan Bhagat fell in Mawla's feet and said loudly:
"Ya Ali madad! Ya Ali madad!Forgive me my Lord, that I doubted your reality!" He was full of awe!
Mawla asked the Mukhi to get a bowl with water and he himself gave Chhanta to Chhagan.
Just like a man wakes up from a deep sleep and sees the reality so different from the dream, Chhagan 's soul got awakened, he reached a unique moment of spiritual awakening like no other!
His entire being got filled with the Noor of Mawla murtaza Ali.
His eyes were filled with tears and he experienced a happiness like no other.
He was totally dumbstruck!
What happened? His world changed!
Imame Zaman then went to the stage , finished the entire program and went away.
After Mawla went away Chhagan rushed to Madhavji bapa and embraced him dearly and greatly overjoyed accepted:
"Madhavji bapa, Mawla is the truth ,he indeed is the Lord of 14 worlds,there is no doubt. Oh Muskilkusha we rely on thee".
He described the form he saw Mawla bapa in.
Madhavji bapa felt so relieved.
They both became great friends then on and later on Chhagan Became one of the greatest Missionary of the time.
He became known as "Chhagan Bhagat" because he made great strides in the spirituality.He was a great lover of the Murtaza Ali.
The next chapter will describe some more miracles in his life.
source:
Mawlani Madhur Vaato (Gujerati)
part 2,page 56 to 67
author:Sairab Abu turabi
English translation:
Dolly Chandani M.D.
Los Angeles California
(9/5/2009) FOR ISMAILI MURIDS ONLY
"Hey Madhavji bapa, Mawla one or two?"
Asked one illliterate Koli villager to Peerbhai Madhvji.
"Oh my innocent brother , how can there be 2 Mawlas?" replied Madhvji.
"But I saw 2 of them" replied the Koli villager named Chhagan
"Then you were not paying attention .Didn't I teach you in the Ginans that there is only one Lord?That means you did not do the Deedar."
said Madhavji with a little concern .
"Oh , no, I did.I saw the 2 men with bright red Jabhhas and golden headwear looking very impressive and everyone in the Pandol were looking at them and reciting salvat I saw both of them very well!", said Chhagan the Koli villager.
Madhvji burst into laughter as soon as he heard this.
"No Chhagan , those two were the Mukhi Kamadias but the one in between them the very young man in white English style coat and suit with the hat looking so very impressive was the Imam!The Saheb!"
"Oh, my dear! I was doing sazdas to those two men in red Jabhhas and golden turbans
First I bowed down to one and then I said Salvat as you taught me, and then I bowed to the second and said salvat.
Now you are laughing but how am I suppose to know who is Hazar Imam? I am a new Ismaili illiterate and ignorant. I have never seen him before .The blind and ignorant are both same." replied Chhagan.
The above conversation took place in a very rural gujarati language in a remote village of Limdi , India after the Deedar.
In 1939 Imam Sultan Mohammadshah visited a small village called Limdi in Gujerat India.
The Ismaili Dawat was in a very significant phase those days.
Persons like Peerbhai Madhvji used to travel from village to village and raise the awareness about the Tenth Naklanki avtar now manifested in the Imame Zaman since 1st Imam Hazarat Murtaza Ali.
It was not an easy task but some of our Fidai workers were very persistent and devoted to the work of davat and many people from various tribes like Kolis, rabaris, Kanbis, lohanas all very poor farmers and shepherds and grocery Men, cooks etc were getting converted to khojas.
(most of us living now in U.S.A, canada, africa,India and Pakistan owe our origins from there.)
Bhagat Peerbhai Madhvji lived a long life of about 80 years but his entire life was devoted to the work of dawat on the path of Satpanth(Sirate Mustakim)
With the ginanic literature given by Peer Saderdin and Peer Hasan Kabirdin thousands of murids were made aware of the Imamat and the satpanth.
His life was full of marvels and miracles of Imame Zaman.
It was a golden period for Ismailis in Hindustan. ( now India and Pakistan) .
Three Imams (47th,47thand 49th) lived there for the longest period and also availed the Jamats of their Deedars and personal interactions which were
so rare in the previous periods and also the current time.It was truly an unique period!
(So much of history lies undisclosed because of language barriers.Nothing was recorded properly because of poor or no technology and also people were very uneducated hence very poorly preserved for future generations)
Madhvji Bapa was inspired to do the work of davat since early childhood.
Peerbhai Madhvji once while travelling from village to village ,spreading Ismaili faith stayed over in a place called "Kanoter"
There lived a Koli villager named "Chhagan"
He was a simple individual with a clean heart and a pious mind.
Just as the birds of the similar feathers flock togather there was a natural affinity among these 2 gentle men based on their lifestyle and piety.
Madvji Bapa used to join the Bhajan Group that recited the devotional songs for the prayers mainly in praise of "Krishna",lead by Chhagan.
There was a verse in Bhajan which indicated towards the arrival of the Tenth avtar in the Kaliyug to destroy the Kalinga.
Lord Krishna was being worshipped as the eigth manifesttion of God
Madhvji asked Chhagan and others the meaning and implication of that verse.
When none of them knew Madhvji explained the presence of Hazar Imam in all ages and time and based on the Ginan affirmed he was the tenth Naklanki avtar, the Mazhar of God.
He explained that God is ever present in this world since time immemorial in various form. It is we who are not recognising him.
He also explained that after Krisna the ninth avtar is finished long time ago and the Tenth avtar is already here for almost 1400 years but we are still stuck to the worship of stone Idol of the God when there is an opportunity to witness a living God and listen to his current guidance.
He convinced a lot of people of Ismaili faith based on his integrated knowledge of Geeta ,Veda Bhagvat and Peer Saderdin's ginanic philosophy.
"Has any of the scriptures said that the God will be in the form of a stone statue?"
Then why are you still not willing to accept the living God instead of a stone Murti?",Madhvji Bhagat asked
"So where is this tenth manifestation of God?and how can we see him?" asked the curious Chhagan.
Madhavji bapa said:
"Yes ,he is present on this earth and I have also seen him." affirmed Mahvjibapa.
He is in the form of a Muslim leader called Agakhan and dresses like a Western man and hence many are not able to recognise him.
The further discussion was so much full of spiritual and batuni concepts that at the end of it the entire group was full of inspiration and love for the Imam and unique eagernes to meet him.
Their eyes were full of tears and heart full of love they requested Madhvji to take them for the deedar of the LORD.
Deedar or darshan was a familiar word for them because some of their Bhajans talked about it.
Madhvji bapa showed them the photo of Imam Sultan Mohammad Shah.
From then onwards started the devotional ginans and Giriyazari tasbihs for the Deedar.
After few months , there came the news that Imame Zaman will be arriving in Limdi( a small town near Kanoter) for the mela.
Mela was like a 7day conference packed with events of few Deedars and other religious ceremonies like Mehmani, Hastamilap(marriages) ,Isme Azam navajish etc.
People from surrounding villages gathered in thousands.There were lots of celebrations and lots of prayers!
So Madvji Bapa took Chhagan and other few men for the Deedar Mela to Limdi.
Now on the occasion of the first Deedar, Chhagan apparently did not recognise the Imame Zaman!
Although illiterate, Chhagan was an intelligent man.
There was one more Deedar next day.
Chhagan came up with a clever new plan!
"Hey Mahvji Bhagat, this time I am going to sit in the very back of the pandol.
You are saying he is the Lord ,so since I did not recognise him atleast He must recognise me as He is our spiritual father.
A child can make mistake but not the father."
"Also Since I have always imagined my Lord to be in a certain form I would like to see him in the same form as I am used to only then your Agakhan can be my Lord otherwise he is the Lord of you Khojas and I have nothing to do with him." said Chhagan in a decisive manner.
"What form ?" asked Madhavji bapa rather alarmed!
"I won't tell you that."
With this sentence he went to the back of the pandol and sat down and with his head down he started the tasbih of "Peer Shah, Peer Shah"
The pandol was full with thousands of murids.
Finally Imame Zaman Shah Sultan Mohammad Shah arrived.The moment was blessed.
Savats were being recited. There was Happiness in the air.
He kept moving everywhere on the red carpet saying Khanavadan and showering blessings.
Here Chhagan was sitting with his face down eyes closed, with a determination that only if Mawla will be seen to him in the "Krisna Bhagvan" form and will recognise him he will be convinced of the Ismaili faith.
A little further away Madhvji bapa was sitting nervously praying" Mawla, you please fulfill Chhagan's desire otherwise I will lose my credibility"
Mawla was walking slowly towards the Takhat after walking around on all the red carpets.
When he was about 10 to 15 steps away from the stage ,he suddenly made a right turn....he stepped out of the redcarpet and making his way through the people sitting he was moving towards the rear end of the pandol! Everyone especially the leaders became confused.
"Mawla, this side, here is the takhat"they tried stopping Mawla.
But Mawla just kept his direction and reached to Chhagan,who was sitting and reciting his tasbih with face down and eyes closed.
Chhagan Bhagat, look up Said Mawla.
Chhagan was indeed startled, he looked up and Lo... he saw Krishna Bhagwan!
He is wearing Yelllow silk pitamber,a jewel studded mukut with peackok feather on the side, a charismatic smile on the face and lot of light surrounding him.
This form was visible only for Chhagan.(as he described later)
"Chhagan bhagat,Is your doubt now cleared?"
"I am the same one who was in Gokul, taking care of the cows.
this is my tenth avtar, now forget Ram Krishna and say Ya Ali madad"
Chhagan Bhagat fell in Mawla's feet and said loudly:
"Ya Ali madad! Ya Ali madad!Forgive me my Lord, that I doubted your reality!" He was full of awe!
Mawla asked the Mukhi to get a bowl with water and he himself gave Chhanta to Chhagan.
Just like a man wakes up from a deep sleep and sees the reality so different from the dream, Chhagan 's soul got awakened, he reached a unique moment of spiritual awakening like no other!
His entire being got filled with the Noor of Mawla murtaza Ali.
His eyes were filled with tears and he experienced a happiness like no other.
He was totally dumbstruck!
What happened? His world changed!
Imame Zaman then went to the stage , finished the entire program and went away.
After Mawla went away Chhagan rushed to Madhavji bapa and embraced him dearly and greatly overjoyed accepted:
"Madhavji bapa, Mawla is the truth ,he indeed is the Lord of 14 worlds,there is no doubt. Oh Muskilkusha we rely on thee".
He described the form he saw Mawla bapa in.
Madhavji bapa felt so relieved.
They both became great friends then on and later on Chhagan Became one of the greatest Missionary of the time.
He became known as "Chhagan Bhagat" because he made great strides in the spirituality.He was a great lover of the Murtaza Ali.
The next chapter will describe some more miracles in his life.
source:
Mawlani Madhur Vaato (Gujerati)
part 2,page 56 to 67
author:Sairab Abu turabi
English translation:
Dolly Chandani M.D.
Los Angeles California
(9/5/2009) FOR ISMAILI MURIDS ONLY
-
FreeLancer
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:20 pm
Many stories mentioned in the book named "Mowla ni Madur Vaato" written by Soraab Turabi proved to be fake. I do not want to criticize his niyat because 100+ years back it was a practice by senior missionaries to coin such fake stories to make Iman strong of momins. I have heard many in waizes proved wrong. I do not want to mention couple of late missionaries who were masters of coining stories. There intentions were good, I am not troubled with that. As I know during Didaars in various countries in past many miracles floated without proofs. Even DJ didaars I have heard few such stories without proof couple of posted on Heritage. Again I do not want to criticize though there are many flaws.
Why Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah kept showing Dus Avtars to some particular persons or a person and not other jamait members? Why Shah Karim has not shown such kind of miracle, never heard.
Why Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah kept showing Dus Avtars to some particular persons or a person and not other jamait members? Why Shah Karim has not shown such kind of miracle, never heard.
I wish you would come to the level of the shoes of those missionaries you are criticising without any evidence, surely then most of the discussions you bring would net be necessary. Meanwhile stop shouting "fake" for info brought to us by people who have gain our respect though merit . If you are a Murid of Trump, you can post all fake news on his website. Not here.
The Imam decides where when or to whom to perform the miracles. In this particular situation the group was comprised of Hindus who wanted to be converted but wanted a proof of the continuity of Imamat from the 9 Avatars they believed in. Hence he provided the proof and they became the most devoted Ismailis.FreeLancer wrote: Why Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah kept showing Dus Avtars to some particular persons or a person and not other jamait members? Why Shah Karim has not shown such kind of miracle, never heard.
Do you know that in the modern era, the proof of Imamat in the court of law is based on a miracle? For more on that, go to:
Haji Bibi Case Incident.
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... opic&t=355
-
FreeLancer
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:20 pm
You and none of other member of this Forum answered me about my query.kmaherali wrote:The Imam decides where when or to whom to perform the miracles. In this particular situation the group was comprised of Hindus who wanted to be converted but wanted a proof of the continuity of Imamat from the 9 Avatars they believed in. Hence he provided the proof and they became the most devoted Ismailis.FreeLancer wrote: Why Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah kept showing Dus Avtars to some particular persons or a person and not other jamait members? Why Shah Karim has not shown such kind of miracle, never heard.
Do you know that in the modern era, the proof of Imamat in the court of law is based on a miracle? For more on that, go to:
Haji Bibi Case Incident.
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... opic&t=355
Why Dus Avtars made compulsory for Satpunthi khojas and not imposed on Central Asians, Afghan, Chinese, or Arab Ismailis? As I have mentioned before hardly any Central Asian Ismaili knows about Dus Avtars, or familiar with names Muchh, Kuchh, Varaha, Nar sei(n)h or Krishna.
For Haji Bibi case as you pointed (I have read it and I have different views), question is why in first place this dispute went out of control. This case was about wealth, virasat,and money.
When true Imam claims he is Imam, there is no need of court of law or miracles. The cousins of Imam knew he was Imam. During Prophet's or Mowla Ali's tenure there is no mention of Dus Avtars in history or Ahadith.
I think each tradition within the diversity of our Jamat has evolved through different cultural and historical contexts. In the contexts of the Jamats in Central Asia, China and Middle East, the prevalent mainstream ideas were based upon the prevalent cultures and traditions. From the Qasidas that I am familiar with, they don't mention any prophets other than those mentioned in the Qur'an.FreeLancer wrote: You and none of other member of this Forum answered me about my query.
Why Dus Avtars made compulsory for Satpunthi khojas and not imposed on Central Asians, Afghan, Chinese, or Arab Ismailis? As I have mentioned before hardly any Central Asian Ismaili knows about Dus Avtars, or familiar with names Muchh, Kuchh, Varaha, Nar sei(n)h or Krishna.
However as the Imam tells us in his Farmans, there is strength in diversity and we can learn from each other. If the other Jamats did not know about Das Avtars, there is no reason why they should not learn about them.
MSMS says in his Memoirs:
All Islamic schools of thought accept it as a fundamental principle that for centuries, for thousands of years before the advent of Mohammed, there arose from time to time messengers, illumined by Divine Grace, for and among those races of the earth which had sufficiently advanced intellectually to comprehend such a message. Thus Abraham, Moses, Jesus and all the Prophets of Israel are universally accepted by Islam. Muslims indeed know no limitation merely to the Prophets of Israel; they are ready to admit that there were similar Divinely inspired messengers in other countriesGautama Buddha, Shri Krishna and Shri Ram in India, Socrates in Greece, the wise man of China and many other sages and saints among peoples and civilizations, trace of which we have lost. Thus man's soul has never been left without a specially inspired messenger from the soul that sustains, embraces and is the universe. Then what need was there for a Divine revelation to Mohammed ?
When custody of money is involved, it is necessary to establish the basis of authority legally in this time and age.FreeLancer wrote: For Haji Bibi case as you pointed (I have read it and I have different views), question is why in first place this dispute went out of control. This case was about wealth, virasat,and money.
When true Imam claims he is Imam, there is no need of court of law or miracles. The cousins of Imam knew he was Imam. During Prophet's or Mowla Ali's tenure there is no mention of Dus Avtars in history or Ahadith.
-
FreeLancer
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:20 pm
Is Dus Avtar a concept, a philosophy, a tradition, or is it included in Tenets of Ismailism? If that is so special or beneficial, Why Imam did not introduced this philosophy to jamaits of Central Asia, or Middle East.kmaherali wrote:I think each tradition within the diversity of our Jamat has evolved through different cultural and historical contexts. In the contexts of the Jamats in Central Asia, China and Middle East, the prevalent mainstream ideas were based upon the prevalent cultures and traditions. From the Qasidas that I am familiar with, they don't mention any prophets other than those mentioned in the Qur'an.FreeLancer wrote: You and none of other member of this Forum answered me about my query.
Why Dus Avtars made compulsory for Satpunthi khojas and not imposed on Central Asians, Afghan, Chinese, or Arab Ismailis? As I have mentioned before hardly any Central Asian Ismaili knows about Dus Avtars, or familiar with names Muchh, Kuchh, Varaha, Nar sei(n)h or Krishna.
However as the Imam tells us in his Farmans, there is strength in diversity and we can learn from each other. If the other Jamats did not know about Das Avtars, there is no reason why they should not learn about them.
MSMS says in his Memoirs:
All Islamic schools of thought accept it as a fundamental principle that for centuries, for thousands of years before the advent of Mohammed, there arose from time to time messengers, illumined by Divine Grace, for and among those races of the earth which had sufficiently advanced intellectually to comprehend such a message. Thus Abraham, Moses, Jesus and all the Prophets of Israel are universally accepted by Islam. Muslims indeed know no limitation merely to the Prophets of Israel; they are ready to admit that there were similar Divinely inspired messengers in other countriesGautama Buddha, Shri Krishna and Shri Ram in India, Socrates in Greece, the wise man of China and many other sages and saints among peoples and civilizations, trace of which we have lost. Thus man's soul has never been left without a specially inspired messenger from the soul that sustains, embraces and is the universe. Then what need was there for a Divine revelation to Mohammed ?When custody of money is involved, it is necessary to establish the basis of authority legally in this time and age.FreeLancer wrote: For Haji Bibi case as you pointed (I have read it and I have different views), question is why in first place this dispute went out of control. This case was about wealth, virasat,and money.
When true Imam claims he is Imam, there is no need of court of law or miracles. The cousins of Imam knew he was Imam. During Prophet's or Mowla Ali's tenure there is no mention of Dus Avtars in history or Ahadith.
The paragraph you quoted from Memoirs suggests that like Abraham, and Jesus; Rama, Krishna, Budha were also messengers or prophets.
Haji Bibi case was all about money. In court of law you have to play smartly to prove you are right.
As per Farman quoted in the second post of this thread, Das Avtars is a philosophy and is applicable to all Ismailis. Why it was not introduced to the Jamats in Central Asia or Middle East could be due to logistical and accessibility issues. However today contacts are established and these concepts can be disseminated to them as well.FreeLancer wrote: Is Dus Avtar a concept, a philosophy, a tradition, or is it included in Tenets of Ismailism? If that is so special or beneficial, Why Imam did not introduced this philosophy to jamaits of Central Asia, or Middle East.
The paragraph you quoted from Memoirs suggests that like Abraham, and Jesus; Rama, Krishna, Budha were also messengers or prophets.
Haji Bibi case was all about money. In court of law you have to play smartly to prove you are right.
MSMS was asked to provide the proof that he was the direct descendant of the Prophet. No smartness would have worked except to perform a miracle.
-
FreeLancer
- Posts: 180
- Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:20 pm
Hello kmaherali, are you awake or sleeping? You wrote, I quote;kmaherali wrote:As per Farman quoted in the second post of this thread, Das Avtars is a philosophy and is applicable to all Ismailis. Why it was not introduced to the Jamats in Central Asia or Middle East could be due to logistical and accessibility issues. However today contacts are established and these concepts can be disseminated to them as well.FreeLancer wrote: Is Dus Avtar a concept, a philosophy, a tradition, or is it included in Tenets of Ismailism? If that is so special or beneficial, Why Imam did not introduced this philosophy to jamaits of Central Asia, or Middle East.
The paragraph you quoted from Memoirs suggests that like Abraham, and Jesus; Rama, Krishna, Budha were also messengers or prophets.
Haji Bibi case was all about money. In court of law you have to play smartly to prove you are right.
MSMS was asked to provide the proof that he was the direct descendant of the Prophet. No smartness would have worked except to perform a miracle.
'Why it was not introduced to the Jamats in Central Asia or Middle East could be due to logistical and accessibility issues'".
Karim, what kind of LOGISTIC or ACCESSIBILITY issues? Were those Dus Avtars heavy enough to carry there. Or that philosophy needed heavy cranes to put on ship to carry that heavy weight to Central Asian countries!!
Admin, please help.
The subject of Das Avatar should be discussed in the Das Avatar thread. This thread is only to add ANECDOTES on Das Avatar.
In this Forum, the software does not allow us to port from this thread to the Das Avatar thread the discussion unfortunately so I would suggest that whatever is important discussion and not anecdote should be copied in the appropriate thread as they will be cleaned from here soon. lets keep Anecdote thread only with Anecdotes and doctrinal or pre-adam discussion in the appropriate thread.
In this Forum, the software does not allow us to port from this thread to the Das Avatar thread the discussion unfortunately so I would suggest that whatever is important discussion and not anecdote should be copied in the appropriate thread as they will be cleaned from here soon. lets keep Anecdote thread only with Anecdotes and doctrinal or pre-adam discussion in the appropriate thread.
DELIVERED BY MR. JAFFERALI LALJI AT THE GOLDEN JUBILEE HALL, DAR-ES-SALAAM, IN SEPTEMBER 1941.
THE AUTHOR WHO has documented WAS PRESENT. !!!
Dear Brothers and Sisters,
A few years ago, I was a Hindu by cast, resident of Gujerat....
Ismaili missionaries from the Recreation Club of Bombay were visiting our Province on mission of propagating Ismaili Faith.
They used to arrange ‘BHAJAN PARTIES’ and ‘SATSANG’ gatherings where I was invited several times.
Your missionaries were, no doubt, well versed in VED, GITA, and PURAN Shashtras and through these scriptures, they endeavoured to prove Ismaili Dharma (Religion) as THE TRUE “SATPANTH” DHARMA where in “NOOR-E-ALI” had descended and IMAM SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH is the FORTY_EIGHTH BEARER of THE “NOOR-E-IMAMAT,” DASMA NAKLANKI AVTAR.
After a number of SATSANG MULAKATS most of the members of our group, numbering two hundred, were convinced of what the missionaries had said about the DIVINE ASPECT of MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH, who was the FORTY_EIGHTH JOMADHARI NOOR MOWLA MURTAZA ALI (SHRI VISHNU VAR DATAR).
We, the participants to the ISMAILI BHAJAN MANDALI, were well convinced and agreed to embrace ISMAILI FAITH, but in one way wished it was practically proved – the DIVINE POWER and the PROOF of the “DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR” by MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH HIMSELF.
Our group submitted the above suggestion because it would be extremely hard for us to discard our faith and desert our relatives, friends and fellow brothers unless we had been convinced to the fullest as to the genuineness of the DIVINE “LIGHT” OF SHRI VISHNU.
After some years following this, good news of Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah’s MUBARAK PADHRAMNI (visit) was announced and our aspirant group was invited to visit Bombay for HOLY DIDAR (encounter).
We all readily agreed to go to Bombay.
During the misssionaries’ MEHMANI, a request was submitted to KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM explaining how a group of Hindus has been given instruction on the present LIVING DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR and a result of various meetings everything was done pending final “PROOF” of KHUDAVIND’S KHUDAI NOOR NAKLANK AVTAR.
Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah was much delighted to read the missionaries’ ARIJA (submission) and most graciously made HOLY FARMAN for the arrangement of a meeting with our Hindu group, of approximately two hundred in number – young and old, ladies, gents, and children.
The next day was a RED LETTER DAY for us.
We made ourselves present at the Recreation Club Office in the morning and KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM arrived at about 11:00 a.m.
At first glance we were very much touched to behold KHUDAVIND’S HOLY DIDAR. MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH, on HIS arrival, said:
“ACCHA TUMKO NAKLANK KA DARSHAN KARNA HAY? SHABASH.”(You want to have the Vision of the Pure?, Excellent)
MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH was seated on the sofa. HIS ‘NOORANI’
complexion was so charming that our hearts and souls, totally and instantly, became devoted and dedicated to HIM.
And LO! In moments there were the amazing appearances of the HOLY DAS AVTARS.
We beheld DIDAR of SHRI MACHHA AVTAR, then KORBHA, VARAH, NARSINHA, VAMAN, FARSIRAM, RAMCHADRAJI, SHRI KRISHNA, SHRI BUDHA, and lastly DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH in HIS DIVINE ASPECT.
We all bowed down immediately in front of the “NOOR-E-PANJTAN PAK”
SHRI VISHNU, ALI VAR AVTAR. (ALLAHUMA SALI ALLAH MOHAMMADAN WA AALE
MOHAMMED.)
Tears of unsurpassable happiness and joy were shed from our eyes.
It was truly an unforgettable event of our lives, which cannot be expressed in its perspective.
However, all the members of our group prayed to KHUDAVIND to accept us all as HIS Spiritual Children.
HAZER IMAM SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH blessed us and said:
“KHANAVADAN”.
HIS “NOORANI” ARSHIDWADS enlightened our souls to such a high extent that we, to this day, cannot express it by words.
It was a day greatest of all days, the day we embraced THE ISMAILI SATPANTH DHARMA where THE “NOORANI” LIVING JYOT is EVER-PRESENT.
We realize that we have SAVED our BILLIONS of BIRTHS and RE-BIRTHS by the HOLY NOORANI DARSHAN and DIDAR.
It is because we recognized the “NOOR” of ALI. SHRI VISHNU, we recognized the “NOORANI” JYOT.
We had been always reading in our SHASHTRAS (Scriptures) of the advent of SHRI KRISHNA, but we were not knowledgeable of the LIVING KRISHNA, we were not knowledgeable of NAKLANKI AVTAR.
We were most fortunate to be graced with the DARSHAN and DIDAR of SHRI NAKLANK – MOWLANA SULTAN MUHAMMAD SHAH, in our lives.
Finally, Mr. Jafferally Laji recited a verse of Holy Ginan.
EJI JO JEEV JAAVE SHAAHKA NAAM NA CHHODU, DHAR SEER KARVAT ANGA NA MODU….
Explanation:- If someone were to cut my throat even, I would not leave the HOLY HOUSE OF HAZARIMAM: HIS HOLY NAME will be on my lips till the last breath of my life. AMEN.
Truly wonderful, amazing and unique, is the story of Huzur Mukhi Jafferali Lalji’s family and colleagues.
**To give a brief introduction of the lecturer: Mr. Jafferali Laji and Count Mohammed Alarakhia were related through the marriage of their son and daughter respectively, which took place after the above incident. ..
Shree Budh came in the form of a leper...Shree Budg had given them a specific time and place he will show up....all the people had gathered....they did not recognize him....Bhim (guard at the door) drove him away....now until today they are still waiting for Dasma Avtar...even today he is right in front of them ! Which other "messiah" are people waiting for?
(Ali) Fatehali Karim, MBA
St Joseph Health System
500 South Main Street, Suite 700
Orange, CA 92868-4507
E-mail: [email protected]
THE AUTHOR WHO has documented WAS PRESENT. !!!
Dear Brothers and Sisters,
A few years ago, I was a Hindu by cast, resident of Gujerat....
Ismaili missionaries from the Recreation Club of Bombay were visiting our Province on mission of propagating Ismaili Faith.
They used to arrange ‘BHAJAN PARTIES’ and ‘SATSANG’ gatherings where I was invited several times.
Your missionaries were, no doubt, well versed in VED, GITA, and PURAN Shashtras and through these scriptures, they endeavoured to prove Ismaili Dharma (Religion) as THE TRUE “SATPANTH” DHARMA where in “NOOR-E-ALI” had descended and IMAM SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH is the FORTY_EIGHTH BEARER of THE “NOOR-E-IMAMAT,” DASMA NAKLANKI AVTAR.
After a number of SATSANG MULAKATS most of the members of our group, numbering two hundred, were convinced of what the missionaries had said about the DIVINE ASPECT of MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH, who was the FORTY_EIGHTH JOMADHARI NOOR MOWLA MURTAZA ALI (SHRI VISHNU VAR DATAR).
We, the participants to the ISMAILI BHAJAN MANDALI, were well convinced and agreed to embrace ISMAILI FAITH, but in one way wished it was practically proved – the DIVINE POWER and the PROOF of the “DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR” by MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMED SHAH HIMSELF.
Our group submitted the above suggestion because it would be extremely hard for us to discard our faith and desert our relatives, friends and fellow brothers unless we had been convinced to the fullest as to the genuineness of the DIVINE “LIGHT” OF SHRI VISHNU.
After some years following this, good news of Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah’s MUBARAK PADHRAMNI (visit) was announced and our aspirant group was invited to visit Bombay for HOLY DIDAR (encounter).
We all readily agreed to go to Bombay.
During the misssionaries’ MEHMANI, a request was submitted to KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM explaining how a group of Hindus has been given instruction on the present LIVING DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR and a result of various meetings everything was done pending final “PROOF” of KHUDAVIND’S KHUDAI NOOR NAKLANK AVTAR.
Mowlana Sultan Mohammed Shah was much delighted to read the missionaries’ ARIJA (submission) and most graciously made HOLY FARMAN for the arrangement of a meeting with our Hindu group, of approximately two hundred in number – young and old, ladies, gents, and children.
The next day was a RED LETTER DAY for us.
We made ourselves present at the Recreation Club Office in the morning and KHUDAVIND HAZER IMAM arrived at about 11:00 a.m.
At first glance we were very much touched to behold KHUDAVIND’S HOLY DIDAR. MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH, on HIS arrival, said:
“ACCHA TUMKO NAKLANK KA DARSHAN KARNA HAY? SHABASH.”(You want to have the Vision of the Pure?, Excellent)
MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH was seated on the sofa. HIS ‘NOORANI’
complexion was so charming that our hearts and souls, totally and instantly, became devoted and dedicated to HIM.
And LO! In moments there were the amazing appearances of the HOLY DAS AVTARS.
We beheld DIDAR of SHRI MACHHA AVTAR, then KORBHA, VARAH, NARSINHA, VAMAN, FARSIRAM, RAMCHADRAJI, SHRI KRISHNA, SHRI BUDHA, and lastly DASMA NAKLANK AVTAR MOWLANA SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH in HIS DIVINE ASPECT.
We all bowed down immediately in front of the “NOOR-E-PANJTAN PAK”
SHRI VISHNU, ALI VAR AVTAR. (ALLAHUMA SALI ALLAH MOHAMMADAN WA AALE
MOHAMMED.)
Tears of unsurpassable happiness and joy were shed from our eyes.
It was truly an unforgettable event of our lives, which cannot be expressed in its perspective.
However, all the members of our group prayed to KHUDAVIND to accept us all as HIS Spiritual Children.
HAZER IMAM SULTAN MOHAMMED SHAH blessed us and said:
“KHANAVADAN”.
HIS “NOORANI” ARSHIDWADS enlightened our souls to such a high extent that we, to this day, cannot express it by words.
It was a day greatest of all days, the day we embraced THE ISMAILI SATPANTH DHARMA where THE “NOORANI” LIVING JYOT is EVER-PRESENT.
We realize that we have SAVED our BILLIONS of BIRTHS and RE-BIRTHS by the HOLY NOORANI DARSHAN and DIDAR.
It is because we recognized the “NOOR” of ALI. SHRI VISHNU, we recognized the “NOORANI” JYOT.
We had been always reading in our SHASHTRAS (Scriptures) of the advent of SHRI KRISHNA, but we were not knowledgeable of the LIVING KRISHNA, we were not knowledgeable of NAKLANKI AVTAR.
We were most fortunate to be graced with the DARSHAN and DIDAR of SHRI NAKLANK – MOWLANA SULTAN MUHAMMAD SHAH, in our lives.
Finally, Mr. Jafferally Laji recited a verse of Holy Ginan.
EJI JO JEEV JAAVE SHAAHKA NAAM NA CHHODU, DHAR SEER KARVAT ANGA NA MODU….
Explanation:- If someone were to cut my throat even, I would not leave the HOLY HOUSE OF HAZARIMAM: HIS HOLY NAME will be on my lips till the last breath of my life. AMEN.
Truly wonderful, amazing and unique, is the story of Huzur Mukhi Jafferali Lalji’s family and colleagues.
**To give a brief introduction of the lecturer: Mr. Jafferali Laji and Count Mohammed Alarakhia were related through the marriage of their son and daughter respectively, which took place after the above incident. ..
Shree Budh came in the form of a leper...Shree Budg had given them a specific time and place he will show up....all the people had gathered....they did not recognize him....Bhim (guard at the door) drove him away....now until today they are still waiting for Dasma Avtar...even today he is right in front of them ! Which other "messiah" are people waiting for?
(Ali) Fatehali Karim, MBA
St Joseph Health System
500 South Main Street, Suite 700
Orange, CA 92868-4507
E-mail: [email protected]
-
aatimaram_1
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:01 pm
Below are two anecdotes which allude to Imamat during the previous Yugas. They are given in Mumtaz Ali Tajdin's "201 - Sweet Anecdotes of Four Beloved Imams" which can be accessed at:
http://ismaili.net/source/books/225anecdotes.pdf
(9) The Imam visited Burma for the first time in 1900. Imam was to go Japan, but he first came in Calcutta and went to Burma by a special boat. On those days, there were about 85 Ismaili families in Rangoon. Here Varas Kara Ruda had established a Sindhi Night School and himself taught religious education to the children.
The Imam was highly delighted to see the Ismailis in Rangoon and said, “It was my fervent desire to see Burma and secondly, I want to bring your small jamat into light.” The Imam closed his eyes for few moment, and said, “Had I seen a small jamat of my believers ever before?” Saying this, the Imam began to think, then said, “Of course, in past during the Duapur Age, I had gone in very dangerous forest to see five Pandvas, Mata Kunta and Sati Dropati, the small jamat of seven souls.” Then, the Imam laughed.
******
(100) In 1934, Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah attended in Bombay a private gathering of the members of the Baitul Khiyal, who reached to different spiritual ranks. The Imam enjoined upon Pir Sabzali (1884-1938) that when any member entered, he/she would whisper in his ear, and according to their ranks, he would make their sitting in the respective rows before the arrival of the Imam. One woman came and spoke something to Pir Sabzali, but he could not comprehend. He again heard second time, but could not grasp to locate her rank. In the meantime, the arrival of the Imam became due, therefore, he told the woman to sit in the last row.
The Imam made gracious arrival and saw the seven row beginning from high to low ranks. Pir Sabzali asked the Imam, where he himself stood, to which Imam pointed with a finger and said, “You sit behind that woman who was given seat in last row.” The Imam started the proceeding and then the members left the room. When all have gone, Pir Sabzali asked the Imam about that woman. The Imam said, “Sabzali, she was Tara Rani. I had promised her to give my didar in my every form (joma).” Pir Sabzali tried
hard to search the woman, but failed.
http://ismaili.net/source/books/225anecdotes.pdf
(9) The Imam visited Burma for the first time in 1900. Imam was to go Japan, but he first came in Calcutta and went to Burma by a special boat. On those days, there were about 85 Ismaili families in Rangoon. Here Varas Kara Ruda had established a Sindhi Night School and himself taught religious education to the children.
The Imam was highly delighted to see the Ismailis in Rangoon and said, “It was my fervent desire to see Burma and secondly, I want to bring your small jamat into light.” The Imam closed his eyes for few moment, and said, “Had I seen a small jamat of my believers ever before?” Saying this, the Imam began to think, then said, “Of course, in past during the Duapur Age, I had gone in very dangerous forest to see five Pandvas, Mata Kunta and Sati Dropati, the small jamat of seven souls.” Then, the Imam laughed.
******
(100) In 1934, Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah attended in Bombay a private gathering of the members of the Baitul Khiyal, who reached to different spiritual ranks. The Imam enjoined upon Pir Sabzali (1884-1938) that when any member entered, he/she would whisper in his ear, and according to their ranks, he would make their sitting in the respective rows before the arrival of the Imam. One woman came and spoke something to Pir Sabzali, but he could not comprehend. He again heard second time, but could not grasp to locate her rank. In the meantime, the arrival of the Imam became due, therefore, he told the woman to sit in the last row.
The Imam made gracious arrival and saw the seven row beginning from high to low ranks. Pir Sabzali asked the Imam, where he himself stood, to which Imam pointed with a finger and said, “You sit behind that woman who was given seat in last row.” The Imam started the proceeding and then the members left the room. When all have gone, Pir Sabzali asked the Imam about that woman. The Imam said, “Sabzali, she was Tara Rani. I had promised her to give my didar in my every form (joma).” Pir Sabzali tried
hard to search the woman, but failed.