[quote="shiraz.virani"]
i tried to agree with you in order to understand that if imam ali[as] was a bolta quran then whats the use of silent quran ...and that is still unanswered !
There is no need for a "silent" quran for you, if you have "bolta" quran.
Allah had sent "bolta" quran (Prophet Mohamed) and did not send "silent" quran, that's the reason the "silent" quran was not compiled during the lifetime of the Prophet.
After the prophet, many rejected Ali as "bolta" quran. Hence the need arose for "silent" quran to be compiled.
But the original quran as revealed to Prophet always remained with Imam Ali and the Imams after him and Allah has promised to protect it.
Bear in mind when 56:78-79 was revealed, the Quran was not in compiled book form but it was and is protected by Allah and no can touch it except “Prurified Ones”.
Questions about Ismailism from a Sunni
To Mr. Virani and Mr. a_27826,But the original quran as revealed to Prophet always remained with Imam Ali and the Imams after him and Allah has promised to protect it.
Good answer indeed, but what about those 10 or 12 paras which had been lost? does Allah will protect it till the day of Qayama or day of Zahoorat?
Where are those lost paras? who has the possession of those paras? off course with Hazar Imam and as per private farman of SMS the imam of that time will disclose it! so wait and see.
BTW:-
Do you know some ayahs which were written on the leafs, which were eaten by a goat!!!?? does we can recovered those ayahs which were digested by a goat stomach? your answer will be no! and that is right, now we will be never ever recovered those digested ayahs!? then how would you can say Quran is complete???
Mr. Virani and Mr. a_27826 brother, Quran is not complete, this subject has been discussed many times in this forum and also other Shia forums too. The current Quran which we have right now is "called Osman Quran" which is not complete Quran brothers ( missing 10-12 paras from it, and God knows!! how many ayahs were eaten by that goat?) the current Quran is altered, omitted, and changed by Osman, and Yazid Palit many times, that is true and history is not quiet about this facts too, only thing you need to read the literature from Shia sources not Sunnis sources which always object this and many Shia beliefs.
If Allah barhaqtala promised to protect Quran then why he didn't protect 10-12 paras which are believed to be lost? why he didn't protected to eat by a goat>
MR-FORGET wrote:To Mr. Virani and Mr. a_27826,But the original quran as revealed to Prophet always remained with Imam Ali and the Imams after him and Allah has promised to protect it.
Good answer indeed, but what about those 10 or 12 paras which had been lost? does Allah will protect it till the day of Qayama or day of Zahoorat?
Where are those lost paras? who has the possession of those paras? off course with Hazar Imam and as per private farman of SMS the imam of that time will disclose it! so wait and see.
BTW:-
Do you know some ayahs which were written on the leafs, which were eaten by a goat!!!?? does we can recovered those ayahs which were digested by a goat stomach? your answer will be no! and that is right, now we will be never ever recovered those digested ayahs!? then how would you can say Quran is complete???
Mr. Virani and Mr. a_27826 brother, Quran is not complete, this subject has been discussed many times in this forum and also other Shia forums too. The current Quran which we have right now is "called Osman Quran" which is not complete Quran brothers ( missing 10-12 paras from it, and God knows!! how many ayahs were eaten by that goat?) the current Quran is altered, omitted, and changed by Osman, and Yazid Palit many times, that is true and history is not quiet about this facts too, only thing you need to read the literature from Shia sources not Sunnis sources which always object this and many Shia beliefs.
If Allah barhaqtala promised to protect Quran then why he didn't protect 10-12 paras which are believed to be lost? why he didn't protected to eat by a goat>
I think, I did not express my views clearly.
The original Quran in the form of revelation is compete and is protected by Allah and is with Imam-e-zamaan.
While Utman’s Mushaf may not be 100% accurate as the words uttered by the Prophet.
Because Uthman’s Mushaf was not authorized/approved by the Infallible Ulil Amr of the Time.
a_27826 wrote:MR-FORGET wrote:It is ok to believe that Quran is not complete and Imam-e-zamaan has complete Quran. But remember the fact that Ali s never corrected so called uthman Quran. Neither any imam has revealed so called protected Quran.
I think, I did not express my views clearly.
The original Quran in the form of revelation is compete and is protected by Allah and is with Imam-e-zamaan.
While Utman’s Mushaf may not be 100% accurate as the words uttered by the Prophet.
Because Uthman’s Mushaf was not authorized/approved by the Infallible Ulil Amr of the Time.
Infallible Ulil Amr of the Time Ali SA never corrected less then 100% Quran for nearly six years while he ruled Muslims.While Utman’s Mushaf may not be 100% accurate as the words uttered by the Prophet.
Because Uthman’s Mushaf was not authorized/approved by the Infallible Ulil Amr of the Time.
No imams have published so called protected Quran.
Stop idle speculations. We Ismailies look foolish when we keep up this blabbering.
Hazrat Ali did not need to correct any written Quran.
Our prophet Muhammad (PBUH) never compilled any Quran. He only revealed it. When he died, this book was not in existense nor was it required by Allah to be compilled, nor did our Prophet (PBUH) dissobeyed Allah by not compiling it. To pretend so is an insult to Islam and to the memory of our beloved Prophet. Who is Usman who pretended to do that which our Prophet (PBUH) did not do. Are you giving him the status of a Prophet?.
When Allah declared "Today I have perfected your religion", the written Quran as compiled by Usman, known today under that name, did not exist.
The Ahl al Kitab are people of the BOOK, not people of the BOOKS. There is only one Book, that is, there is only ONE QURAN, it is with GOD and it is protected by Allah, God.
The Quran is not a series of papers bound together, it is that which is Eternal and lives in Allah forever protected and guiding humanity in all times acording to their time, fourteen hundred years ago, a million years ago, a million years from now.
At the battle of Siffin, Hazrat Ali declared: follow me, I am the speaking Quran.
Which part of the equation don't you understand?
Our prophet Muhammad (PBUH) never compilled any Quran. He only revealed it. When he died, this book was not in existense nor was it required by Allah to be compilled, nor did our Prophet (PBUH) dissobeyed Allah by not compiling it. To pretend so is an insult to Islam and to the memory of our beloved Prophet. Who is Usman who pretended to do that which our Prophet (PBUH) did not do. Are you giving him the status of a Prophet?.
When Allah declared "Today I have perfected your religion", the written Quran as compiled by Usman, known today under that name, did not exist.
The Ahl al Kitab are people of the BOOK, not people of the BOOKS. There is only one Book, that is, there is only ONE QURAN, it is with GOD and it is protected by Allah, God.
The Quran is not a series of papers bound together, it is that which is Eternal and lives in Allah forever protected and guiding humanity in all times acording to their time, fourteen hundred years ago, a million years ago, a million years from now.
At the battle of Siffin, Hazrat Ali declared: follow me, I am the speaking Quran.
Which part of the equation don't you understand?
Hz us an was ruling Khalif and he formed a committee to codify Quran. Hz Ali did not object to it and same codified Quran is used today. You can buy copy at JK.Who is Usman who pretended to do that which our Prophet (PBUH) did not do. Are you giving him the status of a Prophet?.
So what do you consult when you want to memorize a Sura or whole Quran?the battle of Siffin, Hazrat Ali declared: follow me, I am the speaking Quran.
speaking Quran is no longer available.
Speaking Quran is available in the person of the Imam of the Time. We Ismailis are lucky to have the Imam of the Time. To us He is available and will be available forever.
Hazrat Ali objected, he went to the committee compiling the Quran and showed them his entire compilation of the Quran as recited by the Prophet (PBUH). They told him, let us compile ourselves, we do not need your compilation. Hazrat Ali told them, you will never get the true Quran up to eternity, and he went back with his copy. This is explained in detailed by Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah.
Again, we Ismailis are lucky to have the Bolto Quran with us. I wish you also had that chance but I will continue praying that one day, your branch of Islam also recognise the Imam of the Time without whose recognition one dies of the death of an ignorant.
What prpose will it serve to memorise the Quran without the recogniiton of the Imam and without the understanding of what is the glorious Quran, its endless meaning and its mystery?
“Verily it is a Qur’an most honourable... In a Book well-guarded.... None touches it save those who are pure..... Sent down by the Lord of the worlds.”
The Book (Qur’an) is an honourable book and it is "in" a well-guarded Book.
Here is the Mystery:
a Book within a Book which is well guarded !!!.."
Hazrat Ali objected, he went to the committee compiling the Quran and showed them his entire compilation of the Quran as recited by the Prophet (PBUH). They told him, let us compile ourselves, we do not need your compilation. Hazrat Ali told them, you will never get the true Quran up to eternity, and he went back with his copy. This is explained in detailed by Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah.
Again, we Ismailis are lucky to have the Bolto Quran with us. I wish you also had that chance but I will continue praying that one day, your branch of Islam also recognise the Imam of the Time without whose recognition one dies of the death of an ignorant.
What prpose will it serve to memorise the Quran without the recogniiton of the Imam and without the understanding of what is the glorious Quran, its endless meaning and its mystery?
“Verily it is a Qur’an most honourable... In a Book well-guarded.... None touches it save those who are pure..... Sent down by the Lord of the worlds.”
The Book (Qur’an) is an honourable book and it is "in" a well-guarded Book.
Here is the Mystery:
a Book within a Book which is well guarded !!!.."
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shiraz.virani
- Posts: 1256
- Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 2:52 pm
Admin Im having trouble understanding you
1st you said and I quote
Why is it that we still use the very same holy quran in our JK which is found in every mosques and other islamic places and book stores ??
Why is it that we recite the verses of holy quran in JK, we quote the very same surah and aayat with exact same chapter numbers and verses found in so called H.Uthmans so called quran ??
And then thanks to you...you quoted the very same aayats from the very same so called " book of uthman "
....saying its a book well guarded
so first you said
1] Allah [swt] never ordered the compilation of the book but yet
2] H.Ali[as] = BOLTA QURAN ....wasted sooo much of his precious time in collecting those surahs and aayats, even though he knows hez a BOLTA QURAN and to cherry top it
3] Allah said hez gonna guard the book which he never ordered to be compiled in 1st place
So the compilation of holy quran was not required by allah[swt] but yet allah[swt] mentions the holy quran as A BOOK in the holy quran itself
1st you said and I quote
then you said :Our prophet Muhammad (PBUH) never compilled any Quran. He only revealed it. When he died, this book was not in existense nor was it required by Allah to be compilled, nor did our Prophet (PBUH) dissobeyed Allah by not compiling it.
So when as per you the so called book was not in existense during the time of rasool[saw] nor was it required by allah[swt], then why would H.Ali[as] compiled it into a book ??Hazrat Ali objected, he went to the committee compiling the Quran and showed them his entire compilation of the Quran as recited by the Prophet (PBUH). They told him, let us compile ourselves, we do not need your compilation. Hazrat Ali told them, you will never get the true Quran up to eternity, and he went back with his copy. This is explained in detailed by Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah.
Why is it that we still use the very same holy quran in our JK which is found in every mosques and other islamic places and book stores ??
Why is it that we recite the verses of holy quran in JK, we quote the very same surah and aayat with exact same chapter numbers and verses found in so called H.Uthmans so called quran ??
And then thanks to you...you quoted the very same aayats from the very same so called " book of uthman "
....saying its a book well guardedso first you said
1] Allah [swt] never ordered the compilation of the book but yet
2] H.Ali[as] = BOLTA QURAN ....wasted sooo much of his precious time in collecting those surahs and aayats, even though he knows hez a BOLTA QURAN and to cherry top it
3] Allah said hez gonna guard the book which he never ordered to be compiled in 1st place
So the compilation of holy quran was not required by allah[swt] but yet allah[swt] mentions the holy quran as A BOOK in the holy quran itself
Please read correctly before posting. I said the Prophet (PBUH) did not compile it during his time.
Hazrat Ali had a copy, it was not compiled by the prophet.
If it is your position that the compilation was required by Allah, then explain why the Prophet (PBUH) did not compile it and why Allah said that the religion was perfected while the compilation did not yet exist. And did our Prophet (PBUH) failed in compiling or did he decide not to do it on purpose?
Compilation was not required, Hazrat Ali may have done it for historical or archival purpose, it is not up to me to decide why. Islam was already completed before any compilation was attempted by Usman. Please read about the compilation of the Quran.
The jews and christian which are recognised as people of the book do not believe in the Quran but they still are People of The Book. One Book of God, the totality of all the revelations.
If you do not believe that Hazrat Ali was and is the Bolto Quran as he said at the battle of Siffin, it is OK because non-Ismailis are not required to believe this. Since the title of the thread says : question by a Sunni, let me precise, it is Ok for Sunnis also not to believe in that. As Ismailis we do believe that there is no compulsion in religion and we welcome multiple interpretations.
The Imam knows which of the Ayats in the present Quran compilation are authentic and there is nothing wrong in that he has confirmed which ones to be used by us in our various prayers...
I am not sure which part of my previous post you have difficulties understanding but surely there are more important things to do than repeating what is already in the post which I am requesting you to re-read properly.
I do not intend to enter into controversies over this matter, first please go and read on the subject of the compilation, there is plenty of literature available, then read my previous post and you will understand what I am saying. Thanks
Hazrat Ali had a copy, it was not compiled by the prophet.
If it is your position that the compilation was required by Allah, then explain why the Prophet (PBUH) did not compile it and why Allah said that the religion was perfected while the compilation did not yet exist. And did our Prophet (PBUH) failed in compiling or did he decide not to do it on purpose?
Compilation was not required, Hazrat Ali may have done it for historical or archival purpose, it is not up to me to decide why. Islam was already completed before any compilation was attempted by Usman. Please read about the compilation of the Quran.
The jews and christian which are recognised as people of the book do not believe in the Quran but they still are People of The Book. One Book of God, the totality of all the revelations.
If you do not believe that Hazrat Ali was and is the Bolto Quran as he said at the battle of Siffin, it is OK because non-Ismailis are not required to believe this. Since the title of the thread says : question by a Sunni, let me precise, it is Ok for Sunnis also not to believe in that. As Ismailis we do believe that there is no compulsion in religion and we welcome multiple interpretations.
The Imam knows which of the Ayats in the present Quran compilation are authentic and there is nothing wrong in that he has confirmed which ones to be used by us in our various prayers...
I am not sure which part of my previous post you have difficulties understanding but surely there are more important things to do than repeating what is already in the post which I am requesting you to re-read properly.
I do not intend to enter into controversies over this matter, first please go and read on the subject of the compilation, there is plenty of literature available, then read my previous post and you will understand what I am saying. Thanks
Dear Mr. non ismaili brother.. we don't want to hurt your beliefs as we all grow up with these litrature where Hazrat Usman and Hazrat Umar were top notch heroes .. I don't want to argue on these matters.. make your own research about Hazrat Ali and Hazrat Usman n Umar relations .. also read the hadith about them and decide yourself
additionally
also rethink about what you actually believe Quran is...
According to our belief Quran is not only a book with some papers binded and arabic text written ..
but Quran is "Guidance by Allah" which particularly conveyed through our prophet Mohammed .... and God promised to protect those guidance not a book compiled by Usman or whoever. The guidance is still protected but question is where...
Now if you believe its a book only, I don't have much to say about.. but if you think its more than it then find where
We ismaili believe Imam is the Light of Allah through progeny of Hazrat Mohammed and believe that we have Bolta Quran, a protected one
but it was my belief .. if any non ismaili don't believe on it, Its fine....
additionally
also rethink about what you actually believe Quran is...
According to our belief Quran is not only a book with some papers binded and arabic text written ..
but Quran is "Guidance by Allah" which particularly conveyed through our prophet Mohammed .... and God promised to protect those guidance not a book compiled by Usman or whoever. The guidance is still protected but question is where...
Now if you believe its a book only, I don't have much to say about.. but if you think its more than it then find where
We ismaili believe Imam is the Light of Allah through progeny of Hazrat Mohammed and believe that we have Bolta Quran, a protected one
but it was my belief .. if any non ismaili don't believe on it, Its fine....
So far we Ismailies have 49 "Bolta Quran". If you add imam Hassan who is considered imam by other Shias, that makes 50 .We ismaili believe Imam is the Light of Allah through progeny of Hazrat Mohammed and believe that we have Bolta Quran, a protected one
One question bothers me, why are these "Bolta Quran" silent? Imam Ali (s)was ruling whole Ummah for nearly 6 years. He did not publish those so called deleted or goat eaten Ayas or Suras . Do not tell me that he did not know them by heart. In this day and age MHI can record real Quran in a month. What is stopping him?
To sister Noor,
I guess "Bolta Quran" i.e. imam of the time will be keep silence till the day of Zahoorat, and that day he will also introduce the lost paras of Quran.
The second reason Imam's silence is; majority Muslim brothers are not accepting concept of Imamat yet, in my thinking time has not come yet to come forward and shows them what really he is? and where is the lost paras?
I believe Hazarat Ali ruled only 4 years and all those years he was busy to fight with enemies, those wars were unnecessary like 'Jange Zamal" jange Siffin"e.t.c.) enemies forced Hazarat Ali to fight with them even though Hazarat Ali (s.a.) tried his best to stop those wars, so Hazarat Ali had little or no time to compile quran during his caliphat.
During the time of Hazarat Usman when he appointed a committe to compile the Quran, Hazarat Ali (s.a.) was one of that committee member but other committee members didn't gave more importantce to the Quran which Hazarat Ali (s.a.) had during that time, so Hazarat Ali took that Quran back and went back to home.
Who knows? if that committee had accepted that Quranic ayas which Hazarat Ali brought in the committe, might have the lost para??!! as your habit you always raise good and solid question sister!
I guess "Bolta Quran" i.e. imam of the time will be keep silence till the day of Zahoorat, and that day he will also introduce the lost paras of Quran.
The second reason Imam's silence is; majority Muslim brothers are not accepting concept of Imamat yet, in my thinking time has not come yet to come forward and shows them what really he is? and where is the lost paras?
I believe Hazarat Ali ruled only 4 years and all those years he was busy to fight with enemies, those wars were unnecessary like 'Jange Zamal" jange Siffin"e.t.c.) enemies forced Hazarat Ali to fight with them even though Hazarat Ali (s.a.) tried his best to stop those wars, so Hazarat Ali had little or no time to compile quran during his caliphat.
During the time of Hazarat Usman when he appointed a committe to compile the Quran, Hazarat Ali (s.a.) was one of that committee member but other committee members didn't gave more importantce to the Quran which Hazarat Ali (s.a.) had during that time, so Hazarat Ali took that Quran back and went back to home.
Who knows? if that committee had accepted that Quranic ayas which Hazarat Ali brought in the committe, might have the lost para??!! as your habit you always raise good and solid question sister!
[/quote] One question bothers me, why are these "Bolta Quran" silent? Imam Ali (s)was ruling whole Ummah for nearly 6 years. He did not publish those so called deleted or goat eaten Ayas or Suras [/quote]
zznoor thats our problem we don't make our own research and just go with our perceptions and with all we have grown up with. Study the history .. and according to the farman history makes the faith strongest. and keep in mind History doesn't start from Hazrat Mohammed ... start with pre adam time or bhoot kaal sohn kaal time
anyways.. Hazrat Ali went with his compilation on that time but Hazrat Usman the ruler and Umar rejected that. At that time Hazrat Ali said There is no verse, which is not in this Quran. I have completed this so that tomorrow you do not get an opportunity to say that we were unaware of it.
Umar rejected this by saying, The Quran, which is with us, is better that what you are inviting us towards .. or we don't need your version
not sure of exact words though
Hazrat Ali said, On the day of Qiyamat, you should not get an opportunity to claim that I did not call you for my help, or remind you of the fulfillment of my rights over you, and that, I did not invite you to the first and the last from the Book of Allah.
since then Moula bapa never intended to publish the complete version of Quran but those who Obey him, He guide them / us according to the time.
zznoor thats our problem we don't make our own research and just go with our perceptions and with all we have grown up with. Study the history .. and according to the farman history makes the faith strongest. and keep in mind History doesn't start from Hazrat Mohammed ... start with pre adam time or bhoot kaal sohn kaal time
anyways.. Hazrat Ali went with his compilation on that time but Hazrat Usman the ruler and Umar rejected that. At that time Hazrat Ali said There is no verse, which is not in this Quran. I have completed this so that tomorrow you do not get an opportunity to say that we were unaware of it.
Umar rejected this by saying, The Quran, which is with us, is better that what you are inviting us towards .. or we don't need your version
not sure of exact words though
Hazrat Ali said, On the day of Qiyamat, you should not get an opportunity to claim that I did not call you for my help, or remind you of the fulfillment of my rights over you, and that, I did not invite you to the first and the last from the Book of Allah.
since then Moula bapa never intended to publish the complete version of Quran but those who Obey him, He guide them / us according to the time.
Can you quote authentic quote for this story? When, where and to whome, names of reporters etc.samramzan wrote:
anyways.. Hazrat Ali went with his compilation on that time but Hazrat Usman the ruler and Umar rejected that. At that time Hazrat Ali said There is no verse, which is not in this Quran. I have completed this so that tomorrow you do not get an opportunity to say that we were unaware of it.
Umar rejected this by saying, The Quran, which is with us, is better that what you are inviting us towards .. or we don't need your version
not sure of exact words though
Hazrat Ali said, On the day of Qiyamat, you should not get an opportunity to claim that I did not call you for my help, or remind you of the fulfillment of my rights over you, and that, I did not invite you to the first and the last from the Book of Allah.
Then why brag about it and then have to come up with million excuses why no real Quran from 49 bolts Qurans!!since then Moula bapa never intended to publish the complete version of Quran but those who Obey him, He guide them / us according to the time.
Hz Ali ruled for 4 years and 7 monthsI believe Hazarat Ali ruled only 4 years and all those years he was busy to fight with enemies, those wars were unnecessary like 'Jange Zamal" jange Siffin"e.t.c.) enemies forced Hazarat Ali to fight with them even though Hazarat Ali (s.a.) tried his best to stop those wars, so Hazarat Ali had little or no time to compile quran during his caliphat.
Busy in wars is a lame excuse, as a Amir ul momeen he led prayers many times and gave many Khutbas. He has plenty of times to make correction in Quran. Hz Ibn Abbas, Prophets uncle and ward also was equally versed in Quran as revealed to Prophet, he would have supported Imam Ali (s).
Can you support this with authentic quote?During the time of Hazarat Usman when he appointed a committe to compile the Quran, Hazarat Ali (s.a.) was one of that committee member but other committee members didn't gave more importantce to the Quran which Hazarat Ali (s.a.) had during that time, so Hazarat Ali took that Quran back and went back to home.
Why not just stop with thisaminL Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2004 7:32 pm Post subject: Is Quran complete
When the leaders of our concil asked Mowlana Hazar Imam if the Quran was tampered with or if anything was missing he said that the Quran which we are reading today, is the same Quran which was read/composed during the time of Phrophet Muhammad.
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shiraz.virani
- Posts: 1256
- Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 2:52 pm
zznoor...actually I think there is a firman of late sultan mohd shah [48th imam] during his visit to africa where he said openly that H.Uthman has omitted few verses and inserted a few in the book...and he went on to say that if he'z to write the whole quran from the scratch it would take him 6-7 years ..but he promised the khoja jamat that he'll send it to the whole jamat so that they could see what is omitted and what is not.
Well I dunno for sure whether any quran was compiled by the late 48th imam.....If anybody has a copy please lemme know !!
Well I dunno for sure whether any quran was compiled by the late 48th imam.....If anybody has a copy please lemme know !!
Fact remainsagakhani wrote:Shiraz,
You are an Ismaili and being an Ismaili you should know that Sultan Mohammed Shah never compiled the Quran, he must be used the word "IF" before above farman, I want to read this farman again so can you please tell me the date and place where the above farman was made.
None of Devine persons who claim to be "Bolta Quran" has recited Quran as revealed to Prophet. Nor they have published so called authentic tafseer. We have many tafseers by Sunni, Shia, Ahmediya scholars but none from Ismaili Imamas.
Majority of Muslims never Accepted concept of Imamat after the death of Prophet. They do not accept it today and will not accept tomorrow.
Reason given by them
No explicit pronouncement from Prophet.
No explicit Aya in Quran on Imamat.
All this is already old stories, I hope you are not going to debate again what is already known. Sunnis will never believe in the Bolta Quran because they as Shariati.
Shariat and Haqiqat are world apart. How can a Shariati ever understand any thing connected to Haqiqat and what would be any use of discussing such things with Shariati people..
Admin
Shariat and Haqiqat are world apart. How can a Shariati ever understand any thing connected to Haqiqat and what would be any use of discussing such things with Shariati people..
Admin
According to the Farmans of our 48th Imam, the Ginans comprise the ta'wil and tafsir of the Quran.zznoor wrote: None of Devine persons who claim to be "Bolta Quran" has recited Quran as revealed to Prophet. Nor they have published so called authentic tafseer. We have many tafseers by Sunni, Shia, Ahmediya scholars but none from Ismaili Imamas.
Namaz or Salatnuseri wrote:TO:All active participants in this topic.
I wish to know the simple definition of the word DUA and the word namaz?Please it should be in just few lines each.
Is ritual prayer performed 5 times/ day by Muslim.
They are Fajr, Dohr, Asar, Magrib and Isha. They are prescribed in Quran.
Shia combine Dohr and Asar and Magrib and Isha
Wadu or ritual washing is mandatory for Salat.
Each Madhab tries to emulate Prophet's Salat and there are differences.
Dua
Is a supplication to Allah directly or by taking Wasila of saint.
Can be done anytime.
No need for wadu
Google Namaz or Salat for description and videos of Salat of different madhabs.
Can you post Tawil and Tafsir of Quran as per Ginankmaherali wrote:According to the Farmans of our 48th Imam, the Ginans comprise the ta'wil and tafsir of the Quran.zznoor wrote: None of Devine persons who claim to be "Bolta Quran" has recited Quran as revealed to Prophet. Nor they have published so called authentic tafseer. We have many tafseers by Sunni, Shia, Ahmediya scholars but none from Ismaili Imamas.
Let us start with sura al Fateha
TO: ZZnoor.
I have asked for the simple definition and not its features or purpose.as defined to me by a wise person
All prayers in any of religion called by any name is mainly recitation of their holy scriptures with posturing of their body.
By the way in Sufi path of faith,the physical aspect has NEAR ZERO VALUE
to connect to God.
the word namaz or any other fancy name has low value or it is a NON ISSUE for True Ismailis.
I feel persons obsessed with a word of a prayer of any religion should refer it in forum following that fancy word,in this case that person should stick to Sunni websites.
I have asked for the simple definition and not its features or purpose.as defined to me by a wise person
All prayers in any of religion called by any name is mainly recitation of their holy scriptures with posturing of their body.
By the way in Sufi path of faith,the physical aspect has NEAR ZERO VALUE
to connect to God.
the word namaz or any other fancy name has low value or it is a NON ISSUE for True Ismailis.
I feel persons obsessed with a word of a prayer of any religion should refer it in forum following that fancy word,in this case that person should stick to Sunni websites.
Al-Baqir said: No one can claim to have all of the Qur’an, including its manifest aspect and hidden aspects, except the inheritors [the ‘awsiya, the Imams]. (As-Saffar al-Qummi Basa’ir 4:193)...
Al-Baqir said: There is absolutely no one from the people that can say he has the entirety of the Qur’an as it was revealed by Allah except a liar; the one only who possesses it all and has preserved it as it was revealed by Allah was Ali ibn Abi Talib, and the Imams after him. (As-Saffar al-Qummi Basa’ir 4:193...
Al-Baqir said: I do not see anybody in this ummah who has all possession of all of the Qur’an except the inheritors. (As-Saffar al-Qummi Basa’ir
Al-Baqir said: There is absolutely no one from the people that can say he has the entirety of the Qur’an as it was revealed by Allah except a liar; the one only who possesses it all and has preserved it as it was revealed by Allah was Ali ibn Abi Talib, and the Imams after him. (As-Saffar al-Qummi Basa’ir 4:193...
Al-Baqir said: I do not see anybody in this ummah who has all possession of all of the Qur’an except the inheritors. (As-Saffar al-Qummi Basa’ir
nuseri wrote:TO: ZZnoor.
I have asked for the simple definition and not its features or purpose.as defined to me by a wise person
Salat is Islamic Prophetic prayers. Aka Namaz in Persian
All prayers in any of religion called by any name is mainly recitation of their holy scriptures with posturing of their body.
Correct
By the way in Sufi path of faith,the physical aspect has NEAR ZERO VALUE
to connect to God.
Most of Sufi firkas also perform Salat beside zikr.
the word namaz or any other fancy name has low value or it is a NON ISSUE for True Ismailis.
I am shocked. MHI and Imam SMS performs low value prayers? No wonder he is taking his time giving Ismaili Namaz till Ismailis are ready for it.
I feel persons obsessed with a word of a prayer of any religion should refer it in forum following that fancy word,in this case that person should stick to Sunni websites.
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