Shiraz,Great question agakhani bhai.....I think even animals submit to allah[swt]
That is right Kbhai, but in my opinion the first reason to recover vedas from /Hayagriva/Shankashr was for future use for Human being not for animals because if you look in Allah's whole creation then you will find that only human being is breaking 'LAW OF NATURE' not animals and birds, they are still follows as same as they used to thousands and thousands years ago but look the human being, now a days human being doing every thing against the teaching of Vedas because human kind has mind and intelligence which creates many questions in his minds. Now a days Human being is challenging to the God a superior authority (almighty Allah) because Human beings has mind and intelligence which other animals doesn't have, have you heard any animals challenged the God ever? there were and there are some good and bad men on this earth all the time i..e. since the first men walked on this earth. Vedas were saved and recovered for these bad peoples, so that they can read it and learned lessons from them, and give up there bad deeds and always follows the saying of vedas.According to scripture the role of the Machh Avtaar was to destroy the demon in the water and to recover the Vedas and hence the restoration of knowledge.
It is the nature of the Divine to guide according to the times. That is the reason we believe in the living Imam. What is the use of preserving Vedas for the future when fresh guidance can be made available to humans when they emarge?agakhani wrote: That is right Kbhai, but in my opinion the first reason to recover vedas from /Hayagriva/Shankashr was for future use for Human being not for animals
I think you are mixing the evolutionary time frame with the time period of Das Avtaar. The fish that the Imam refers to is a permanent appearance of the manifestation of the fish as witness when the the evolutionary stage was that of a fish, just as today the Imam is a man.star_munir wrote:Interesting discussion is going on.
Karim, given below is an extract from article "History in Ginans" from heritage website. What are your views on it?
Imam Sultan Mohamed Shah said “When there was nothing but fish on earth, God stood as Witness and you must have no doubt to that kind of witness from above.”(Mission Conference, Dar-es-Salaam, 1945)
Do you think human beings were there since the time of very first avataar or since the time period of 3rd avataar?
Do any one has complete report of what Imam said in this regard in Mission Conference, 1945?
As I said earlier, I believe human devotees existed right from the 1st Avtaar (Machh Avtaar).
Brother agakhani , our universe is far beyond our imagination...Having said this what makes you think that humans did not exist during the time of matsya avatar ??It is sad that even I proved giving example from Hindu scriptures, Hindu Purans and from our ginans that there were no human being existed during the time of Matsya Avatar but if some one still hanging on his/her own thinking then that is fine with me? I can't impose the facts on them, same way Kbhai you can't impose and force your own believe to some one else who don't agree with you and with the theory of swami Yuktesharji written in his book "The Holy science".
according to one post of brother maherali bhai and correct me if Iam wrong he said god has sent over 50,000 adams[as] on earth.....I would go one step further I would say 50,000 is just the figure...how many adams were sent down may be far beyond 50,000 as we all know that universe is always expanding..
Mr. Virani,Anyways I dont want you to get twisted but if maherali bhai is saying that humans indeed were there then yes Im on his boat
Brother agakhani just like you even I used to believe in the darwins theory of evolution but often at times it has been discredited ....like say for example humans being monkeys in the past....Nobody knows when did humanity came into existance....recently there was this discovery of huge giant humanoids in sri lanka and other places whoz height can be measured in meatures and not inchesNot only 50.000 but I would say may be 500.000 Adams already born on this earth, I don't have any objection for that nor I have any objection if you don't agree whatever I wrote above that there were no human being was evolved during the time of 1st cycle or Karta Yug, however I am still backing what I wrote above believe it or not it is up to you.
But let me tell this, those Adams were not just born just like this that Allah push the computer button and Adams were born right away as per the Darwin theory every creature on this earth has to evolve first, the first creature on this earth was in water you can call it "amoeba" this amoeba on this earth was first Adam, but this Adam/ameoba was not in human shape because human beings still has to wait thousand and thousand years to evolve yet.
....according to certain scientists these fossil date some millions of years old......MILLIONS !!There is this saying of H.Imam Ali[as]shiraz.virani wrote:
Today we know that the mountains prevent earth from shaking...subhanallah !!!
haha
You're right agakhani bhai....Remember in one topic i.e meru parvat you said something about mountains height and thats when I laughed at you...I just wanna let you know that you were rightNot only in Quran but in many other scriptures also it is quoted that God had created mountains to balance this earth.
"Chalo der se aaye leking durast aaye."You're right agakhani bhai.... just wanna let you know that you were right
shiraz.virani wrote:Oh and If you still dont get it my friend, I would put it like this in the simplest terms
The expansion inside the earth, according to what they (the geologists) claim, keeps the earth together while its revolving in a high speed around itself, and prevents it from getting out of balance and shaking while revolving.
If mountains and hills didn't exist today, then the earth's incredible fast rotation around itself would be shaky and we would be having earth quakes every minute of our lives.
You dont know anything thats written in holy quran because you dont read it and even if you do, you never understand what written in it and you want me to answer your questions ?? ....Wake Up !!!!!!
I don't know. You seem to selectively reply to what you think you have answer, and ignore the ones that you are ashamed to answer.shiraz.virani wrote:Dint I tell you that debate with those who are worth debating ?And what causes earthquack, according to you and your belief system??? ... let me guess. Women who shake their bosoms...
You're still not getting it ?? ....You're not worth debating my friend...You never basically debate...all you do is argue...and anyways you debate with someone who has something to share ...apart from your knowledge of bosomsI don't know. You seem to selectively reply to what you think you have answer, and ignore the ones that you are ashamed to answer.
shiraz.virani wrote:You're still not getting it ?? ....You're not worth debating my friend...You never basically debate...all you do is argue...and anyways you debate with someone who has something to share ...apart from your knowledge of bosomsI don't know. You seem to selectively reply to what you think you have answer, and ignore the ones that you are ashamed to answer.
Brother the only reason why Im so polite to you is because I promised MR-FORGET that I would not say anything that would hurt our ismaili brothers and sisters...Once again my brother the reason why I ignore you is because you're an ignorant. You dont know basics about quran or its message but still wanna act as if you're a true ismaili who is fighting for Hazar Imam....Your ignorance is quite evident when we touched topics like earth quakes and causes of earth quakes to which all you could do is laugh....well what else could we expect from you ??Like I said, you can't answer.
What do you have to share? Apart from blaming our beloved Imam and promoting your mentor's (akbarali maherali's) ideas and agendas? At least I am honest and saying it to your face. Not a coward like yourself, who wears ismaili mask and pretend to be one. Go have a life and do something meaningful with your life, as opposed to wasting your time promoting anti-ismaili ideas of your mentor.
