Well Vasanji,
though the topic was started giving suggestion to a particular member how he can contact tarqa board for conversion process...but larer on as you will read you will get to know the topic diverted and we are just talking about whether the conversion process is right or not..
As for Zubair, I think I should stop the discussion here. I have given my views as for what I understood from Ginans, Farman etc..I dont claim that I have very good knowledge or I am right but with whatever limited knowledge I do have and what I just generally think is the process should not be very complicated.
In short I dont agree with what you are saying. I think if I will write more then may it become never ending debate..I understand view and repect your views very much as there can be different thinking of different people and every can have thier own ideas as per thier intellect or the way they think.
Contacting Local Tariqa Board
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star_munir
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As I said I should stop my discussion in my previous post, but I think its better to give reference...so here it is.star_munir wrote:Well Vasanji,
though the topic was started giving suggestion to a particular member how he can contact tarqa board for conversion process...but larer on as you will read you will get to know the topic diverted and we are just talking about whether the conversion process is right or not..
As for Zubair, I think I should stop the discussion here. I have given my views as for what I understood from Ginans, Farman etc..I dont claim that I have very good knowledge or I am right but with whatever limited knowledge I do have and what I just generally think is the process should not be very complicated.
In short I dont agree with what you are saying. I think if I will write more then may it become never ending debate..I understand view and repect your views very much as there can be different thinking of different people and every can have thier own ideas as per thier intellect or the way they think.
In Ginan Eji Chela chodi...., Syed Mohammad Shah says:
Eji saacha din Rasool ka tame sahi kari jaaro
Je koi chahvey din ku taku din mai aanro....
As for reference in Farman: Kutch Nagpur, 25-11-1903, KIM part 1
Its about when a twelver Shia requested to become Ismaili.
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zubair_mahamood
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Ya Ali Madaad Munir,star_munir wrote: As for Zubair, I think I should stop the discussion here. I have given my views as for what I understood from Ginans, Farman etc..I dont claim that I have very good knowledge or I am right but with whatever limited knowledge I do have and what I just generally think is the process should not be very complicated.
In short I dont agree with what you are saying. I think if I will write more then may it become never ending debate..I understand view and repect your views very much as there can be different thinking of different people and every can have thier own ideas as per thier intellect or the way they think.
We are hear to learn, tomorrow we may not survive but I hope our words will on this site… this particular thread is started by someone trying to contact board n what happens later… we don’t see people discussing this issues or be diplomatic while discussing…! Most of the postings help us to know better ourselves, our faith and practices but this thread is of some special situation which is practical… I don’t see it as I m trying to convey you. We live in our space and make opinions according to our knowledge and experience so it’s normal to have differences in opinions some times we don’t agree with ourselves (like we have differences between heart and mind) so its normal. I accept we don’t think a like…!
I didn’t start posting in this thread because I wanted to convince you but I saw a person wanting to know our faith got discouraged (I don’t know what his real intention was) so just to show him other side of the mirror I started posting and you came in to help me….We discussed about complication in decision making and some reason why it is complicated as well as we discussed if a person is true and serious he will find a way but need to be patient…. We discussed things with practical example which I think can open some doors for someone frustrated, which can give someone hope to believe in God, believe in tomorrow, believe that everyday will not be same, believe not one can stop you if your sincere …!
I don’t know still you understand me or not but if someone is in the satiation where Allah calls him and closed doors will sure understand me… Thanks for discussing with me brother…
Ya Ali Madaad
Zubair Mahamood
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star_munir
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Mowla Ali Madad Zubair,zubair_mahamood wrote:Ya Ali Madaad Munir,star_munir wrote: As for Zubair, I think I should stop the discussion here. I have given my views as for what I understood from Ginans, Farman etc..I dont claim that I have very good knowledge or I am right but with whatever limited knowledge I do have and what I just generally think is the process should not be very complicated.
In short I dont agree with what you are saying. I think if I will write more then may it become never ending debate..I understand your views and repect your views very much as there can be different thinking of different people and every can have thier own ideas as per thier intellect or the way they think.
We are hear to learn, tomorrow we may not survive but I hope our words will on this site… this particular thread is started by someone trying to contact board n what happens later… we don’t see people discussing this issues or be diplomatic while discussing…! Most of the postings help us to know better ourselves, our faith and practices but this thread is of some special situation which is practical… I don’t see it as I m trying to convey you. We live in our space and make opinions according to our knowledge and experience so it’s normal to have differences in opinions some times we don’t agree with ourselves (like we have differences between heart and mind) so its normal. I accept we don’t think a like…!
I didn’t start posting in this thread because I wanted to convince you but I saw a person wanting to know our faith got discouraged (I don’t know what his real intention was) so just to show him other side of the mirror I started posting and you came in to help me….We discussed about complication in decision making and some reason why it is complicated as well as we discussed if a person is true and serious he will find a way but need to be patient…. We discussed things with practical example which I think can open some doors for someone frustrated, which can give someone hope to believe in God, believe in tomorrow, believe that everyday will not be same, believe not one can stop you if your sincere …!
I don’t know still you understand me or not but if someone is in the satiation where Allah calls him and closed doors will sure understand me… Thanks for discussing with me brother…
Ya Ali Madaad
Zubair Mahamood
I know here we are to learn and to share our knowledge.
I commented in my previous post because among this good discussion there was a point of argument between us. As I think ki there is mistake from side of tariqa board also. I understand that they can not say yes to every one but there should be reply atleast.
I am not misunderstanding you Zubair. I understood what you were trying to say was just to give positive hope to that person.
But what I was saying is ki no one is perfect and all the work by Ismaili institution is also not always perfect. You know I had read book about Ismaili history by Farhad Daftary, it was published by Institute of Ismaili Studies London, but there were many mistakes in that book. Some time you may will hear some shocking things that happens in Aga Khan hospital. So the thing is that no one is perfect and we should not expect perfectness from any one. It is not necessary that all work carried out by an Institution is as per guidance of Imam. You may read the discussion about changing in Ginans.
There are weaknesses in all of us and first point to improve is to admit that there are weak points in us, there are mistakes by us. If we will think our institutions are hundred percent right every time then how they will ever become right? first step for improvement is to admit that no one is perfect.
Thats just the thing I dont want to argue or discuss more. So far as you want to share your experiences etc I will like to discuss it with you.